Metal scale advice?

[Darknightrei]

This is somewhat of a resurrection of Edirkian's thread regarding creating scale armor posted a few months back.

My father has aquired a vast supply of stainless steel disks from work and I intend to use them to craft some pretty composite armor. I plan on creating leather forearm, shoulder, shin/knee, pelvis, upper torso, and head armor with chain and scale attached to provide coverage as well as mobility. Does anyone have any advice on this concept or helpful info for making sure my armor will be safe as well as effective, without sacrificing my concept?

[frazzgnarth]

Simply put, don't do it. Scales if done properly don't really work in this sport. A large number of even blunt objects all pointing in the same direction will act as a grater is something moves against their orientation. This would happen against foam helping break down other people's weapons faster as well as skin which would be the more important issue in my book.

[Darknightrei]

I understand as far as grating goes for large patches of stationary scale, however my intention is to have chainmail 'skirts' draping from pieces of the armor with single, or double rows of scale (attached directly to the chain at 4 points so as to have no lift up) at the portions closest to the leather. The scales will be smooth edged and will not allow any digits to slip between them. Each scale is larger than an eye socket as well. Skin grating shouldn't be an issue either because of armored grappling rules. Would that be any more of a pinch or scratch hazard than chain alone? If scale is faux pas, then shouldn't the rules reflect it as such? I am willing to admit my newbishness and accept the advice of Bel veterans, but if there's a way to make it work I'd like to. Worst case scenario, I'll have to stick with just the chain.

[frazzgnarth]

Well you're definitely talking about using scale on a much smaller scale than Ed was discussing some months ago, and in that application and properly secured, I can't see anything that would stop you.

Point of interest you may want to look into, though. With regards to armor and grappling, the rules only limit you from initiating a grapple, not participating in one if someone decides to grab you.

[Darknightrei]

Point of interest you may want to look into, though. With regards to armor and grappling, the rules only limit you from initiating a grapple, not participating in one if someone decides to grab you.

I think that falls into the "don't pet the porcupine" section of my logic database lol.

[Forkbeard]

1. You need to make sure all of you edges are very smooth.
2. You need the make sure the edges of the holes you punch in the scales are really really smout if you want to lace them together.
3. You need to dish each scale a little bit. Depending on the placemnet, some need more curve than others. Flats scales look terrible.
4. Prepare youself for many, many hours of brain num ine work. Scales and chain take forever and are not fun.
fb

[Arrakis]

Simply put, don't do it. Scales if done properly don't really work in this sport. A large number of even blunt objects all pointing in the same direction will act as a grater is something moves against their orientation. This would happen against foam helping break down other people's weapons faster as well as skin which would be the more important issue in my book.

This is not true. Have you ever seen this actually happen?

[Forkbeard]

I,m with arrakis. But domt answer. Let's not derail this into *.
let's talk about making scales work.

Fb

[frazzgnarth]

My apologies on being misinformed. I'm all for making it work. I was just going off of what I've read previously on these forums about trying to make a scale based armor.

It'll probably fail for being a weapon grater. A rising shot on most scale will destroy foam.

There's another thread around here with scale mail and more people were concerned about it being a grater against human skin during a grapple, than they were for weapons.

From the topic that Rei was referencing viewtopic.php?f=107&t=34818

So basically, we can make scales effective by curving them inward and of course making sure everything is penny round. Sounds good to me, I'll let Edirkan know his old armor concept isn't completely derailed, although i think he has given up on the idea by now. I haven't heard anything from him about it in months.

[Edirkan]

Hell no I haven't given up! I'm all for scale, I think it would be amazing! Glad to see two people I respect most on the boards rooting for this to work, and between us we should be able to come up with something viable

[Darknightrei]

1. You need to make sure all of you edges are very smooth.
2. You need the make sure the edges of the holes you punch in the scales are really really smout if you want to lace them together.
3. You need to dish each scale a little bit. Depending on the placemnet, some need more curve than others. Flats scales look terrible.
4. Prepare youself for many, many hours of brain num ine work. Scales and chain take forever and are not fun.
fb

Luckily the scales in question are the byproduct of a hydraulic die. So they are dished a little and have a smooth outer edge, I just have to grind out the inside edge and punch smooth holes. As for brain numbing work, lets say I have a tolerance for mind alteration, lol.

[No'Vak]

As for brain numbing work, lets say I have a tolerance for mind alteration, lol.

I like you.

[Oisin]

People have lots of dumb ideas about armour, especially of the metal sort. Don't let it get you down. Just ignore them.

How thick are the disks you intend to use as scales? Depending on that, this could get extremely heavy. Scale has a lot of overlap.

[Darknightrei]

I like me too...

As for the disks, they're roughly 1/16 of an inch thick and about 2 inches in diameter, give or take a bit as I am bad at estimations and have no ruler handy. Weight could be an issue, but that's why I'm making the armor half leather, 1/4 chain, and 1/4 scale. I cannot, for the life of me, find an example online. I'll try to explain:

I will have 5 separate pieces of leather armor. A helm, Breastplate with attached pauldrons that will cover upper torso, a thick belt with tasset, and lower leg/knee armor. Attached to the breastplate, pauldons, and belt's bottom edge will be chain 'skirts' that drape down over the gaps in the armor. Attached to the uppermost portions of chain, closest to the leather, will be one or two rows of scale.

[No'Vak]

I like me too...

As for the disks, they're roughly 1/16 of an inch thick and about 2 inches in diameter, give or take a bit as I am bad at estimations and have no ruler handy. Weight could be an issue, but that's why I'm making the armor half leather, 1/4 chain, and 1/4 scale. I cannot, for the life of me, find an example online. I'll try to explain:

I will have 5 separate pieces of leather armor. A helm, Breastplate with attached pauldrons that will cover upper torso, a thick belt with tasset, and lower leg/knee armor. Attached to the breastplate, pauldons, and belt's bottom edge will be chain 'skirts' that drape down over the gaps in the armor. Attached to the uppermost portions of chain, closest to the leather, will be one or two rows of scale.

Just dont have scale over your elbows/knees.