Becoming The Best

[Soo Ma Tai]

Drive and desire do nothing if you never learn to swing the sword. The aren't the foundation, they are the glue, nails etc, that hold the whole thing from coming apart. Striking, footwork, etc, are the base and framework, thus the word basics. They provide the base. The drive and desire allow you to build on that framework. It allows you to maintain being the best by continuing to improve. Desire and drive alone do not make a good fighter. We have a guy here, Silverwolf....tons of desire, listens, trys the stuff we tell him. Unfortunately he does not possess the physical skills necessary, coordination etc, to even master the simplest of strikes. He will likely never be the best, becuse he lacks the physical skills necessaruy to do so. He simply can't learn the basics needed.

[Loptr]

Been reading this thread.

BattleChrist would make a statement that struck me as off or wrong, then he would explain his logic. I think his points are accurate to being the best on a given day. I also think he is acknowledging this is a temporary at best state. The long term win requires the double D’s.

Soo- I agree with a lot of what you say too. Silverwolf has the desire but apparently not the drive. Example: Silverwolf gains the drive, he gets himself a pell and spends an hour a day using good from and style to learn the proper aspects of a shot. Doing this shot slowly to get the proper form and style then he builds the speed up until it is combat speed with proper form. Following this logic in all the disciplines he needs to master he could become one of the best.
Bruce Lee said: (summary) Don’t fear the guy that has practiced 10,000 kicks once, fear the guy that has practiced one kick 10,000 times. I say this is the DD’s.

Soo- also has it spot on with the But without a phat stache it is all pillow talk.

L

[BattleChrist]

Been reading this thread.

BattleChrist would make a statement that struck me as off or wrong, then he would explain his logic. I think his points are accurate to being the best on a given day. I also think he is acknowledging this is a temporary at best state. The long term win requires the double D’s.

L

That is a good way to sum up what my points are.

Also are you going to thawl this year i didn't get to fight you at all last time.

[Kerb]

Drive and desire do nothing if you never learn to swing the sword. The aren't the foundation, they are the glue, nails etc, that hold the whole thing from coming apart. Striking, footwork, etc, are the base and framework, thus the word basics. They provide the base. The drive and desire allow you to build on that framework. It allows you to maintain being the best by continuing to improve. Desire and drive alone do not make a good fighter. We have a guy here, Silverwolf....tons of desire, listens, trys the stuff we tell him. Unfortunately he does not possess the physical skills necessary, coordination etc, to even master the simplest of strikes. He will likely never be the best, becuse he lacks the physical skills necessaruy to do so. He simply can't learn the basics needed.

Soo, How do you propose someone learns to swing a sword that has no desire to learn or drive to practice? To me learning is a function of having the desire and drive to want it. Now yes those are the physical basics, which you learn and practice because you have drive and desire. I have said the drive and desire are not the end all be all, they are the base that you build these things upon. The person that has the drive and desire to be the best has a chance at doing so, but that does not mean they will be the best. A person with no desire or drive to be the best has essentially no chance in hell of getting there. We are not disagreeing that the physical basics are highly important, but you will never learn them without the desire to do so. There is much more to fighting than physical skill, but yes, if someone for whatever reason can not physically hack it, they do not stand a chance either, as they are now missing the next "floor" of their fighting monument.

[BattleChrist]

Soo, How do you propose someone learns to swing a sword that has no desire to learn or drive to practice? To me learning is a function of having the desire and drive to want it. Now yes those are the physical basics, which you learn and practice because you have drive and desire. I have said the drive and desire are not the end all be all, they are the base that you build these things upon. The person that has the drive and desire to be the best has a chance at doing so, but that does not mean they will be the best. A person with no desire or drive to be the best has essentially no chance in hell of getting there. We are not disagreeing that the physical basics are highly important, but you will never learn them without the desire to do so. There is much more to fighting than physical skill, but yes, if someone for whatever reason can not physically hack it, they do not stand a chance either, as they are now missing the next "floor" of their fighting monument.

The thing you're not getting is that this isn't thread about what it takes to become the best it is what makes the best peroson on the field the best. Drive/Desire are things you HAVE to have in order to get better but they are NOT a sum of skills.

[Kerb]

Subject: Re: Becoming The Best ....

[Big King Jimmy]

Drive is about maintaining a position at the top and getting their at the first place. If you remove time from this equation and look at a single snapshot, a really good fighter doesn't need drive, because the future is irrelevant in the scope of the argument.

[Kerb]

looking at a snapshot to determine who is best is a lot like determining the winner of a sports game at the halfway point, sure your right for that moment, but who knows what can happen by the end of the game.

Since this game essentially has no end you can't have a definitive answer to who is The Best when its all said and done, because that never happens.
This is why I have been asking questions to those that say drive and desire are unnecessary in who the best happens to be. I see the point they are trying to make, I really do, if you froze everything to a single point of time then I would agree with them, but we can't do that currently so I keep asking why they are throwing out such attributes when they play such a huge part in the ever evolving definition of "The Best".

[BattleChrist]

Subject: Re: Becoming The Best ....

HAHAHAHA really? Read the first post champ.

looking at a snapshot to determine who is best is a lot like determining the winner of a sports game at the halfway point, sure your right for that moment, but who knows what can happen by the end of the game.

Since this game essentially has no end you can't have a definitive answer to who is The Best when its all said and done, because that never happens.
This is why I have been asking questions to those that say drive and desire are unnecessary in who the best happens to be. I see the point they are trying to make, I really do, if you froze everything to a single point of time then I would agree with them, but we can't do that currently so I keep asking why they are throwing out such attributes when they play such a huge part in the ever evolving definition of "The Best".

Which is the point of this conversation, it's not asking how to get there or for a spacific person just what the best fighter has and drive/desire don't change their skill if they are the best.

[Kerb]

HAHAHAHA really? Read the first post champ.

I did read the first post, the OP asked, "What, to all of you, makes someone the best fighter on the feild? No names, just ideal abilities etc."

So I ask, where in those two sentences is it asked of this discussion to freeze time and get a cross section of only physical skills that "The Best" would have. Drive and desire MAKE someone the best fighter, just like physical fitness MAKES someone the best fighter. You are thinking in a very narrow frame of mind, at least that is how I read what you post.

Also, I apologize if my satirical post offended anyone, it was just too golden an opportunity to have someone post "The thing you're not getting is that this isn't thread about what it takes to become the best" then look at the very message you have to click on just to read this thread say the exact opposite.

Which is the point of this conversation, it's not asking how to get there or for a spacific person just what the best fighter has and drive/desire don't change their skill if they are the best.

Again, we disagree, as I just wrote, the making of the best fighter, i feel requires Drive and Desire, and that seems to be exactly the scope of this thread. Also, Drive and Desire is what propels The Best to stay ahead of The Rest and therefore they can remain The Best on the field instead of chumping out because at the start of the war they were the best so they didnt need drive or desire anymore for that day. ; )

[Arkin]

Physic posted this a while ago

I believe there are 4 fundamental elements in fighting. Here they are in order of importance.

Body
Movement
Technique
Mind

All of these weave together to form your personal skill level. If any of these are lacking they will bring down the others and you will not be fighting at your full potential. You should always be evaluating each of these through your fighting career. Whenever you find one that is falling behind that is when you need to reevaluate your training.



Body- This is the base of all fighting. If your body is not prepared to learn movement and technique you will never reach a skill level where the mental elements come into play. Physical preparedness will help in preventing most injuries. It is also a major factor in creating speed, power and endurance.


Movement- The body must be conditioned or your movement will be sluggish. Technique will not get you far if your body is not in the right position. You will not be able to manipulate the fight if you cannot be where you need to. Movement is key in changing angles, range and timing in a fight.


Technique- Without being physically prepared your technique will be weak, slow and without power. Movement must flow with technique if you are to be ready for every scenario in battle. Your focus on a fight will expand tremendously when your attacks are instant without thought. Technique allows for efficiency in combat. It will remove wasted movement and is the biggest influence on speed and power.


Mind- This is where it all comes together. All of the other elements combined will allow your mind to calculate and react to everything that happens in a fight. There are so many facets to the mentality of combat, which is what makes it the final piece of the puzzle. So many things fit into this category. Timing, spirituality, manipulation, willpower, calculation, and research are all things that can be attributed to the mental game.

But Dag Im going to be the best fighter ever so dont even waste your time.

[BattleChrist]

Well Kerb and i aren't going to agree but for the most part i agree with everything else, hope all these ideas have helped you decide what you think makes someone the best Dagganoth. Also you better go to next Chaos Dag.

[p_quick]

Well Kerb and i aren't going to agree but for the most part i agree with everything else, hope all these ideas have helped you decide what you think makes someone the best Dagganoth. Also you better go to next Chaos Dag.

Kerb wins =) determination and desire was it?

[p_quick]

oh wait it was drive wasn't it

[bo1]

did anyone say implacability? been working for me.

[Slagar]

Nope. Kerb's secret is the same as mine. Bhakdar said it best: lefty, lanky, and athletic. I am, and so can you!

[Kerb]

Well Kerb and i aren't going to agree but for the most part i agree with everything else, hope all these ideas have helped you decide what you think makes someone the best Dagganoth. Also you better go to next Chaos Dag.

Kerb wins =) determination and desire was it?

I didn't win, we weren't fighting. I was actually more intrigued on how he came to his conclusions. Then I was trying to explain myself more adequately so he could see how I came to my conclusions. Although I do get satirical and defensive at times.

However, I think i've clearly gotten my point across, and now you guys are already giving away my secrets, how could you?? How could you?

[Brennon EH]

However, I think i've clearly gotten my point across, and now you guys are already giving away my secrets, how could you?? How could you?

Piffle. Your secret is you lived with me for two years.

[Kerb]

Not anymore.

*, I don't get to keep any secrets here.

[MeleeMoses]

Becoming the best will never happen to anyone. There will always be a fighter who will have your card.

Having fun, in my opinion, is the best way to become a strong fighter

that's why i fight in the first place, to have a good time! Not to try to prove something to everyone, **** em. I fight to fight and have fun. Loose myself on a **** day with an amazing sparring session. Fight because you love it. Not because you want your glory and praise.


Also connection with the community. Enough so that some of them even become your family.

these things are how i became a good fighter and will always keep me fighting

for fun and family, not to tell someone i am better then them

thats all

[Brennon EH]

Becoming the best will never happen to anyone. There will always be a fighter who will have your card.

I don't really agree with this statement. At the really high end, fighting is a constant race to adapt. On a given day I might beat the pants off of Spyn, Arthon, or Lief. On a given day they might beat the pants off of me. And then we adapt, evolve, and things switch again.

'Beat the pants off of' is a little misleading. If we are going 60-40, we are running our mouths about how awesome we are compared to the other guy. The issue is we adapt so swiftly that it's hard to maintain any long-term advantage.

Finally, being the best isn't about beating every person, every time. There was a good while during my formative years where I could break even (or better) against the top-tier fighters in the game. Did that make me better than them? Did it make me a top-tier fighter? No; it meant my fighting style and scope were highly focused at the time. They were still way more successful on a broad spectrum.

[Roland Demox]

Nope. Kerb's secret is the same as mine. Bhakdar said it best: lefty, lanky, and athletic. I am, and so can you!

Lanky?...I hate to be the first to tell you this Slagar but your kinda a beefy dude

[Kerb]

Becoming the best will never happen to anyone. There will always be a fighter who will have your card.

Having fun, in my opinion, is the best way to become a strong fighter

that's why i fight in the first place, to have a good time! Not to try to prove something to everyone, **** em. I fight to fight and have fun. Loose myself on a **** day with an amazing sparring session. Fight because you love it. Not because you want your glory and praise.


Also connection with the community. Enough so that some of them even become your family.

these things are how i became a good fighter and will always keep me fighting

for fun and family, not to tell someone i am better then them

thats all

Believe me, if I did not have fun fighting I wouldn't do it anymore. I have alot of fun, but I also have fun in winning, and controlling the fighting. I don't go out of my way to prove myself, I let people think of me what they will. But I also love the thrills of trying my hardest and accomplishing feats that are in front of me.

Also, I, just like Brennon, disagree that there can never be a "best". Now to have someone that is completely unstoppable, that may indeed be a pipe dream.
But even if the person that is the best changes every second, someone still will be the best. The problem comes in defining who that person is, as we see in this nice long discussion, we can't even agree on the parameters to make a definition.

[Slagar]

Nope. Kerb's secret is the same as mine. Bhakdar said it best: lefty, lanky, and athletic. I am, and so can you!

Lanky?...I hate to be the first to tell you this Slagar but your kinda a beefy dude

*, I think Demox just called me fat. I'm going to go cry into a pint of chunky monkey, and then whoop some * at practice tomorrow.

For the record, I fight to have fun. I also have fun when winning. Just because this is a game doesn't mean I'm not here to compete. I love every minute of fighting, winning or losing. Even so, I'm going to work my * off to make sure I bring home the win. That's part of what makes this game so much fun. The freedom to compete, to fight as hard as I can, and to know my opponent is doing the same. Otherwise, I might as well be rolling dice, you know?

[Roland Demox]

Its alright Slagar, I am grossly out of shape

Well said, one thing I appreciate about this game however is you can turn to the competitive sport side, or the fantasy game side. Or ride somewhere in between. Its something that appeals to ALL audiences

[MeleeMoses]

Also, I, just like Brennon, disagree that there can never be a "best". Now to have someone that is completely unstoppable, that may indeed be a pipe dream.
But even if the person that is the best changes every second, someone still will be the best. The problem comes in defining who that person is, as we see in this nice long discussion, we can't even agree on the parameters to make a definition.

You are correct.....I'll go ahead and take that step. I am a better fighter then all of you....I am the best

thread over

[p_quick]

hmmhmm, you are gunna make alot more people go to Chaos wars if you keep talking like that

the ego's will comith

[MeleeMoses]

lollie

[Kerb]

Also, I, just like Brennon, disagree that there can never be a "best". Now to have someone that is completely unstoppable, that may indeed be a pipe dream.
But even if the person that is the best changes every second, someone still will be the best. The problem comes in defining who that person is, as we see in this nice long discussion, we can't even agree on the parameters to make a definition.

You are correct.....I'll go ahead and take that step. I am a better fighter then all of you....I am the best

thread over

Prove it.

[p_quick]

Also, I, just like Brennon, disagree that there can never be a "best". Now to have someone that is completely unstoppable, that may indeed be a pipe dream.
But even if the person that is the best changes every second, someone still will be the best. The problem comes in defining who that person is, as we see in this nice long discussion, we can't even agree on the parameters to make a definition.

You are correct.....I'll go ahead and take that step. I am a better fighter then all of you....I am the best

thread over

Prove it.

i second that

[xiao]

TALENT is the p_quickest way to the A list

[MeleeMoses]

I have god on my side....I DON'T NEED PROOF!!!!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Mekoot Gorlock]

plus it's not like you can prove him wrong.

[p_quick]

plus it's not like you can prove him wrong.

true words Mr President

[Kerb]

plus it's not like you can prove him wrong.

Yet.

[BattleChrist]

Yet.

Ever.

[Brennon EH]

Is this kid intentionally a troll, or just an imbecile?

[Kerb]

Is this kid intentionally a troll, or just an imbecile?

I think he just likes me.

[p_quick]

hah

[BattleChrist]

Is this kid intentionally a troll, or just an imbecile?

Troll joke it can be whatever you want it to be

[Ralimar]

There was this one fight... when it was over, I was the last man standing, and I knew that I was the best that there ever was or ever would be.

And it was scary. So I stopped doing it.

You're welcome.

[p_quick]

rali do you still fight? the last time i fought with you was at a SW like 6 years ago...

[Relg]

Didn't you read his post?

And it was scary. So I stopped doing it.

Emphasized for emphasis.

[Aleksii]

Moses was the best, till adam beat him.

[Juicer]

Nobody's yet mentioned the true way to be the best:

Cheat.

[Mekoot Gorlock]

rali do you still fight? the last time i fought with you was at a SW like 6 years ago...

that's because you don't go to chaos.

[Soo Ma Tai]

Come to Chaos Wars and fight the (self-proclaimed) BEST IN THE SPORT!!

[Juicer]

Come to Chaos and learn why the WEST COAST IS THE BEST COAST.

[MeleeMoses]

you guys are great

[Big King Jimmy]

I'm the best.