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 Post subject: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 8:48 pm 
Brute
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Lately, I've been giving people headshots over and over again (atleast once every practice). I was beginning to wonder why and now I found out the reason! The peeps in my realm have gotten wise to my redsword abilities so they have taken it upon themselves to throw a shot at me at the exact time I throw a redshot. Now, I am not complaining about this technique, it is very effective, when it works out. I get one redshot off but I lose one of my arms.

But the problem I see with it is, especially when it comes to large redswords, is that once the sword is moving in a certain direction, its nearly impossible to stop it. For instance. I am facing off against a shieldman, I swing for one of the upper corners of his shield but he decides to throw a shot because he knows I can't block AND he moves his head right into the path of my incoming redshot. A nasty headshot follows. What can be done??

Should I discontinue aiming for the area altogether? I could but that would make me even more inneffective. Should the shieldman wait for me to swing and THEN counterattack? He could but I would take his shield. Only thing I can think of that remedies this is moving onto smaller redswords so that any potential face shot is less dangerous. But at the same time, why should I have to change my fighting style to accomodate other fighter's recklessness. Do glaivemen have the same problems?

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 19, 2011 10:25 pm 
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Sleeper wrote:
he moves his head right into the path of my incoming redshot.


So its not your fault. Theyre head boxing without knowing it? Perhaps tell them theyre doing it so they'll stop.


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:48 am 
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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 1:53 am 
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My 2 cents. Tighten up the angles of the chops you're throwing as you or your opponent gets closer.
Sleeper wrote:
Should the shieldman wait for me to swing and THEN counterattack?
Depends on how well they can parry your shot, or how much of a hurry they're in. I tend to wait for someone with a red to swing, before advancing. The more committed they are to breaking my shield (or bones) the more likely I'll hesitate.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 5:39 am 
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Congrats, your realm has finally progressed to the point where you need to feint. Stutter the shot you've been throwing, catch their counter-shot, hack their arms off. Repeat until they stop responding predictably.

What you have here isn't a problem, it's an opportunity.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 7:19 am 
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I have forced many a red shot into my head from using the tactic that you describe, Sleeper. I used to get really * at the red fighter until I saw myself doing it on camera. My point is that if they are willing to allow themselves to get hit head just to disable your arm it's their bad. I will second Slagar in the feint to catch the arm technique. Now that you know what they are going to try and do to hit you first use it to your advantage to draw them out.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 9:09 am 
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Practice more. Learn more shots.
Change your starting position. Especially when facing one of these head-boxers. LEARN. If you can deliver good shots from new angles, they will never know exactly where you're coming from.
Also, if you KNOW the fool if going to stick his head in your way, like Slagar says, **** feint, then hit them there anyway. This makes them look like a sucker. That gets old fast.
Have a couple neutral people at practice whatch, and maybe video tape you doing this. Show the head boxers. Seeing themselves do something embarassing on tape will convince them faster than anyone telling them

Really though, I think you need to learn to chagne your starting position. These guys are predicting your movements. Do something different.
FB.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 9:20 am 
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yep, anytime you know what they are likely going to do, you should win with no trouble.

stutter to the shot they expect and dont throw it. let them move in and kill you a couple times. just watch where they go and what they do. yes you will lose, yes you are letting them win a few. but in the end you are denying them everything. once you see what they are doing and the likely shots they throw, put together a block and swing that maximizes your defence while getting you a limb or body shot. i really like alimb shot as it tends to be more reliable and many people cheat a shoulder area shot for an arm so i find it helps me to just go for the arm right off, know that i have aanother shot for them to be gone. plus if i get a good shot and they call it arm, i am ready to drive the point home with my next shot already.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:03 pm 
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Feinting, starting positions, all that does not stop this headshot. Nothing does. Was thinking of it alot and I still come back to the same conclusion, PEOPLE NEED TO TAKE LIGHT REDSHOTS. I've broken an arm, a bunch of fingers, cut someone's face wide open and fractured someone's teeth. Why? Because people don't want to lose their shield, so they tell me to hit their shield REAL hard. Bad thing is, once the sword is moving, you can't stop it. Guess this thread is done, you guys have some good suggestions but its all been said and done before. Maybe we'll just have to live wit it, people always tell me, "we signed a waiver". Sorry guy's, I will continue to try and avoid headshots BUT, I can guarentee nothing.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 12:10 pm 
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Slagar wrote:
Congrats, your realm has finally progressed to the point where you need to feint. Stutter the shot you've been throwing, catch their counter-shot, hack their arms off. Repeat until they stop responding predictably.

What you have here isn't a problem, it's an opportunity.


Exactly how I broke someone's arm. They swung, I swung, my sword hit his forearm. But since people need HARD shieldshots to break a shield, I cranked on it but instead of hitting and breaking the shield, I hit and broke something else.

(our realm has being doing crazy stuff for a long time, long before I got there, its just very difficult to feint/stutter, using a six foot redsword. It can be done, but not in the same way you could with a smaller weapon.)

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 1:06 pm 
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See, that's **** up. A hit is a hit is a hit. If you would take the red hit to your torso, arm, or leg, you should take it to the shield too. Otherwise you are asking the red user to swing unsafely. A good hit is a good, solid shot, not a baseball swing from the way back machine. That, hit my shield harder than you hit me crap is something I have been trying to fight for years exactly because it causes people to start being unsafe.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 2:41 pm 
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Maybe it's just because it was the standard where/when I was brought up in the game, but it makes perfect sense to me. A shield would need way more abuse to be 'broken' than a person in real life. So why not in Bel?

If you're really breaking jaws, then that's a problem, though. I don't know what to tell ya, man.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:12 pm 
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Sleeper wrote:
I've broken an arm, a bunch of fingers, cut someone's face wide open and fractured someone's teeth. Why? Because people don't want to lose their shield, so they tell me to hit their shield REAL hard.


Not quite broken jaws, but close enough for me to call the practice unsafe. If you start s swing with such force that you cannot control the weapon after that, you are swinging to hard, and it is unsafe. A fighter should always be in control of their weapon.

And wile I understand the realism of having to swing harder against a shield, the fact remains that it is unsafe to do so, therefore, it should not be ok to do. That mentality fails the first of the big three, safety, payability and realism.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 3:40 pm 
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No.
You were just given very good advice for the closest thing to profesional swordfighters as YOU'RE * is ever likely to meet and you say you,ve tried it and it doesn't work? Then you are not doing the things we suggested correctly. Matbe you should go and practice instead of just thinking you need to swing hard.
I think th problem lies solely with you. You are always talking up your red sword skills, while you * about stuff like this.
Here,s the facts, kid. I am the biggest, hardest hitting person around here. I fight with the same weapons you do. I regularly knock people down woth red hits. I have one the last 4 national tourneies I have entered.
I HAVE NEVER INJURED ANYONE. Ever. YOU are doing it wrong.
sorry if this is hard to take, but you need to look at yourself. Your skills, and your motivation to fight to work this out.
fb

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 4:48 pm 
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nicely said fork, agree.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 8:10 pm 
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Forkbeard wrote:
No.
You were just given very good advice for the closest thing to profesional swordfighters as YOU'RE * is ever likely to meet and you say you,ve tried it and it doesn't work? Then you are not doing the things we suggested correctly. Matbe you should go and practice instead of just thinking you need to swing hard.
I think th problem lies solely with you. You are always talking up your red sword skills, while you * about stuff like this.
Here,s the facts, kid. I am the biggest, hardest hitting person around here. I fight with the same weapons you do. I regularly knock people down woth red hits. I have one the last 4 national tourneies I have entered.
I HAVE NEVER INJURED ANYONE. Ever. YOU are doing it wrong.
sorry if this is hard to take, but you need to look at yourself. Your skills, and your motivation to fight to work this out.
fb

You mad cause I didn't agree wit ya? I DID, I said those were good pointers but, like I said before, how you gonna stop a headshot if people step into em.


And you say you use big weapons like mine, lol, and knock people off their feet without hurtin them? *. Big weapons will always be dangerous, no matter who swings em. Maybe you guys don't do much practice, and if so, you guys don't fight that much. I go through redswords in one month at times, my last one lasted only two weeks. Why? because people want you to give them bone breaking redshots. If I don't give them one, they don't take the redshot.

Now, I am not saying everybody does that but when alot of the vets do it, then thats a problem. Why? Because other people see and hear them and they follow suit. "Oh that wasn't hard enough... boo hoo". STFU, you want me to hit you hard, I have no problem with that, what I do have a problem with is HURTING people. Nothing kills the mood more than a nasty injury. The guy's arm that I broke, when that happened, it seemed to "kill" the field, everybody left and yeah, I kinda felt bad for hurting the guy, it was his first event.

Shut up, so I didn't go all ooogly with your, so called, wise words or tactics. But for clarification, explain it in detail about your badass techniques you have that will fit fighting with a redsword thats six feet long, that will stop headshots. How long have you been fighting Forkbeard?

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 20, 2011 8:38 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 9:56 am 
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Tearcil finnaly said something I agree with. Good on ya.
Sleepy, I have been fighting 18 years.
We fight twice a weeks here. I'm not going to argue with you.
You ARE doing it wrong. I would have kicked you out of my group by now for injuring other fighters with your unsafe fighting. We have NEVER had to do that, though. Even though we have several guiys in the active militarty who are over 200 lbs. No on has ever broken a bone at our practice.
If you don't want to listen to the advice of your better, why did you come in here and ask for it? You seem to just want to tell us all how bad * you are.
Well, you are not. You are just sloppy.
FB

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:20 am 
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I started in Dur-D in 1993-94-ish, how old were you then Sleeper?

Again, if you aren't in control of your weapon, there is an issue.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 2:25 pm 
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Forkbeard wrote:
Tearcil finnaly said something I agree with. Good on ya.
Sleepy, I have been fighting 18 years.
We fight twice a weeks here. I'm not going to argue with you.
You ARE doing it wrong. I would have kicked you out of my group by now for injuring other fighters with your unsafe fighting. We have NEVER had to do that, though. Even though we have several guiys in the active militarty who are over 200 lbs. No on has ever broken a bone at our practice.
If you don't want to listen to the advice of your better, why did you come in here and ask for it? You seem to just want to tell us all how bad * you are.
Well, you are not. You are just sloppy.
FB

nah dawg, I got ya. I don't care, my reasons that I don't follow your little suggestions is THIS place is not the first place I've asked the question. I've asked everyone around here in DurD and they pretty much say the same thing. And yes, I did try all of em, only suggestion that I agree with is moving onto a small sword.

And we've had people break eachothers bones ALOT. Okay, not alot, but a few. I've broken my own finger swinging the big sword. You guys just must'nt fight hard. But I have to give it to ya, I've only been fighting for six years, maybe seven, I agree you are more of a vet than me.

Its cool, call me a bad fighter all you want, not gonna stop me.


* Soo Ma Tai

Was about Ten. Eleven maybe. And I have control over my sword, well, as far as one can with a big sword. They are different than glaives, why? Cause they have a small handle, less control, more redshot power. So yes, any large sword is gonna be dangerous. There was a time when I used to get headshotted left and right, but I realized it was my own fault, I was spinning, putting my head right into the paths of their weapons. So I stopped.

Guess the bottom line is I was hoping you guys would have better suggestions than what people around DurD have already told me. But ya didn't. Just repeated it all. Some of it, I guess I am irked that people want me to give them a really hard redshot. As said before, I love swinging hard, but I hate hurting people.

(hah, you got me, I am just braggin about how badass I am, even though I lose more fights than I win.)

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 6:11 pm 
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This is just begging to be picked apart.


You guys just must'nt fight hard.
[*, you have no grounds to say that to anyone unless you have been to their practice.]

I've broken my own finger swinging the big sword.

[This statement refutes the first part of the next]

And I have control over my sword,

well, as far as one can with a big sword.
[You can have perfect control over a big sword; you just don't.]

They are different than glaives...
[They're shorter.]

Cause they have a small handle,
[Build them with with bigger handles. You can have 2 feet of handle on a six foot sword, more if you add some incidental padding and grip that. Hell you can cut some blade foam right off the core if you don't want to build a whole new sword. All in all, that's no excuse; it's easily fixed.]

less control,
[See above.]

more redshot power.
[Simply wrong. The extended handle of a glaive allows for much more power.]

So yes, any large sword is gonna be dangerous.
[If used improperly.]


Guess the bottom line is I was hoping you guys would have better suggestions than what people around DurD have already told me.
[Then the guys at DurD gave you good advice.]

But ya didn't.
[What the **** is with "ya". How much time did you save typing "a" instead of "ou"?]


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:03 pm 
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Sleeper, your weapons sucked badly when I lived in Nashville. Like, I was tempted to build you an actually nice redsword just once so you'd get addicted to how nice fighting with a well-made weapon is and have to start buying good stuff instead of just duct taping bad foam to whatever core you have handy at the time and covering it with a pair of nylons.

If you're still making crap swords, then you going through them that quickly is reasonable. I recommend you build something nicer (this will help you keep from breaking humans, as well). However, I don't recall you hitting particularly hard. Of course, I built stabbing tips on my swords and so rarely had difficulty defeating red weapon fighters from Dur Demarion, so maybe that is warping my experiences.

Anyway, Fork is right, as he sometimes is: if stuttering and then throwing elsewhere or changing your starting position and opening shots isn't stopping the headshot, you're not doing those things like you think you are or you're dealing with one particularly bad headboxer who really does deserve the brain damage.

Ask a good sword'n'board vet to help you work on it. I don't know if anyone of any ability still fights down there, though. Is Koom still fighting? Iliak? I know Izzy isn't...


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2011 10:16 pm 
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I take back my "It's notyour fault" comment.


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2011 12:50 pm 
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Sleeper wrote:
Lately, I've been giving people headshots over and over again

Like you do.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2011 1:10 pm 
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Vocabulary. "Harder" is a nonspecific term.

example: Person A punches someone in the chest and breaks their rib. Person B pushes someone in the chest and they fall over.

Who hit harder?

Person A exerted more force in a short time window. They hit harder?
Person B exerted more force overall. They hit harder?

Hitting hard in Belegarth is about riding the line between the two kinds of harder. You want enough punch to make it smack, but not damage. The foam in weapons helps convert the punch into push. Speed and weight add punch. For safety's sake, you have to error on the side of push.

With experience and practice, you get more and more control and can push right up to that line more of the time. To be clear, though, this isn't about being "better" or stronger, or even about being able to hit "harder" in any kind of absolute sense, this is about gaining a sensitivity to what the Belegarth standard of hitting is.

And for control. Another example:

Sprint a set distance past a line. Sprint the same distance to a wall.

The first time is going to be faster. You don't have to worry about stopping.

You can swing faster if you don't have to worry about hitting someone in the head. But since you do, you can't swing that fast. That is a disadvantage, it's a safety thing, that's the way it is. A lighter weapon can swing faster and more carefree in that regard.

So you have to swing more like you're sprinting to a wall. but... not exactly. If, instead of a blank wall, you were sprinting towards a wall with a couple doors in it, and someone was trying to stop you, but could only close one door at a time. You would not be able to sprint as fast as going past the line, but if your judgement was good, you would be able to go faster than you would if you had to stop at the wall since you would accelerate to the finish.

This is feinting speed. Gaining in options and control what you're giving up in pure speed.


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Sat Oct 22, 2011 9:12 pm 
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Arrakis wrote:
Sleeper, your weapons sucked badly when I lived in Nashville. Like, I was tempted to build you an actually nice redsword just once so you'd get addicted to how nice fighting with a well-made weapon is and have to start buying good stuff instead of just duct taping bad foam to whatever core you have handy at the time and covering it with a pair of nylons.

If you're still making crap swords, then you going through them that quickly is reasonable. I recommend you build something nicer (this will help you keep from breaking humans, as well). However, I don't recall you hitting particularly hard. Of course, I built stabbing tips on my swords and so rarely had difficulty defeating red weapon fighters from Dur Demarion, so maybe that is warping my experiences.

Anyway, Fork is right, as he sometimes is: if stuttering and then throwing elsewhere or changing your starting position and opening shots isn't stopping the headshot, you're not doing those things like you think you are or you're dealing with one particularly bad headboxer who really does deserve the brain damage.

Ask a good sword'n'board vet to help you work on it. I don't know if anyone of any ability still fights down there, though. Is Koom still fighting? Iliak? I know Izzy isn't...

yeah. they were crap swords, I agree. But if I go through Edhellen redswords just as fast as my own, I don't think it has anything to do with the construction. I destroyed an Edhellen greatsword in ONE day (at Rag) so no, it isn't my sword durability. (hah, without your stabby, I used to crush you, but before you left, you were kicking my * left and right, I remember.) Koom still fights but not at Elmington, Illiac is still there, still woopin me but yea, haven't seen Izzy for a LONG time. And no, its not the same person, there are a few. (however, though your weapons were pretty, they were overweight, but maybe you got better, but thats just my opinion) I built my swords to be light. I once built monsters that were a foot wide and would never hurt anybody, even when hit in the face. (Raquee, rockee, a famous BloodFalcon even disarmed me and hit me in the head with one and It didn't hurt in anyway). But people started to refuse to take my redshots, no matter how hard I hit. So I moved onto the less padding. People started taking their redhits, but thats when I started injuring people. When I first started, it wasn't like that.

At Fratari:
This is just begging to be picked apart.
(I'll defend my words)


You guys just must'nt fight hard.
[*, you have no grounds to say that to anyone unless you have been to their practice.]
(I could say the same, he's never seen me fight, therefore he can't say I'm sloppy or unsafe)
I've broken my own finger swinging the big sword.

[This statement refutes the first part of the next]
(how?)
And I have control over my sword,

well, as far as one can with a big sword.
[You can have perfect control over a big sword; you just don't.]
(I do, like I said, swords are different than glaives, its all in the handle)
They are different than glaives...
[They're shorter.]
(perhaps, but if I make a seven foot redsword, its a sword, not a glaive)
Cause they have a small handle,
[Build them with with bigger handles. You can have 2 feet of handle on a six foot sword, more if you add some incidental padding and grip that. Hell you can cut some blade foam right off the core if you don't want to build a whole new sword. All in all, that's no excuse; it's easily fixed.]
(Its not excuse, maybe it came off that way, but, like I said, if I followed that, it would become a glaive, and I suck at glaive fighting. I am decent at swording, its all in the handle length.)
less control,
[See above.]

more redshot power.
[Simply wrong. The extended handle of a glaive allows for much more power.]
(For me, I can deliver a harder redshot, because thats what I am used to. I could explain but that would take to long)
So yes, any large sword is gonna be dangerous.
[If used improperly.]
(Tell that to people in DurD. Maybe the "correct" way is to not fight at all with them)

Guess the bottom line is I was hoping you guys would have better suggestions than what people around DurD have already told me.
[Then the guys at DurD gave you good advice.]
(They did, and if you read my posts above, I agreed)
But ya didn't.
[What the **** is with "ya". How much time did you save typing "a" instead of "ou"?]
(lol who gives a ****. ya mad?)




At Phlebas:

What I mean by "harder" is simply swinging hard. But there are a few that refuse to take a redshot unless it makes a loud SMACK, regardless of how hard it hit, even when I move them. They seemed to standardize on how hard a redshot is and yes, some (Thrax, Slaug) will take light redshots. Others, want you to literally move their body. I remember tearing someones shield off their handle.


But I'll try all the suggestions, again. I am moving onto small redswords. (you guys make think I am bragging but ask the DurD vets about me, I am like the joke of belegarth, cloudsword, blah blah blah. But I am not bragging, I think some people might have misunderstood my words about hurting people. Admitting something like that can be hard but I thought what the hell, might as well, even if it makes me look bad)

Peanut: cool, I got ya. If I am wrong, I will admit it. But I don't agree..... yet. I will try this crap out tommorrow, if I still hit someone in the head, well, guess its time for a big reevaluation of how I fight, as ole Fork said.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 7:55 am 
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Changing your fighting style will take months. I'm not surprised that you have had no sucess trying the thing we recomend if you are expecting things to change in one day of fighting.
Looking forward to seeing you at Rag. I'll show you how it's done.
FB

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 8:25 am 
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Sleeper wrote:
I destroyed an Edhellen greatsword in ONE day (at Rag) so no, it isn't my sword durability.

****. I think he's throwing flat headshots with a red sword.


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 11:51 am 
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Another thing I think you should consider is the fragile nature of real swords.
Real swords break if you fight stupid hard with them. Doing the wrong thing at the wrong time can bend, shatter, or just snap off a real steel blade. Part of fighting with large 2 handed swords in real life is doing it WITHOUT breaking it, so that you can continue to fight more people.
If you are tearing swords apart the way you say, you are definently doing it wrong.
I remeber your Edhellen redsword tip failure thread well. That was your fault for tip fighting.
Read, lean, then go out and work on being a netter fighter, not a harder hitter.
FB

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 5:02 pm 
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Tiercel wrote:
****. I think he's throwing flat headshots with a red sword.


Siglined

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 8:28 pm 
Brute
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Forkbeard wrote:
Another thing I think you should consider is the fragile nature of real swords.
Real swords break if you fight stupid hard with them. Doing the wrong thing at the wrong time can bend, shatter, or just snap off a real steel blade. Part of fighting with large 2 handed swords in real life is doing it WITHOUT breaking it, so that you can continue to fight more people.
If you are tearing swords apart the way you say, you are definently doing it wrong.
I remeber your Edhellen redsword tip failure thread well. That was your fault for tip fighting.
Read, lean, then go out and work on being a netter fighter, not a harder hitter.
FB

Very much agreed. I heard even the largest two handers would probably still break against plate armour. But as far as the tip fighting, its not done on purpose, people do alot of back stepping.

As far as the tips you guys mentioned, I think, would be better shown in person than relayed over the net, maybe I am understanding wrong. (Don't think I was the one that created that thread, then again, I don't remember)

I will definately try to make it to Rag next year, it would be awesome to learn things from you, plus to be able to fight the legendary forkbeard, probably will lose but I shall try my best.


At Slagar and Tiercel:
You may think it, but have you seen my swords? They have directional padding meant to stop just that, flat hits. Problem with wide bladed swords are they can flip to the side after a hit, leading some to believe they just got flatted. It would be easier to explain it in person. I am not gonna scrutinize my own sword fighting skills here, would take to long. (I can though, I got time, haha)



(did try them out but I didn't hit anybody in the HEAD! Well, not with my lil redsword. However, did slap some peeps in the face when I was forced to use a shield and blue, same reason, lol. Got faced a few times to though, glad I had my helm.)

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Sun Oct 23, 2011 10:05 pm 
Slayer
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Meh. I said my bit to try and help. I don't think there's more benefit to be gained from my posting in this thread, so I'm not.

At the moment the realm I'm in is wrestling with itself over whether or not to keep loaner reds in with the pile of loaner gear for new fighters. The locals can't grasp why handing noobs red swords may be bad, and Tiercel's line just made me crack the **** up. So I siglined it. I was getting kinda bored with the banner anyways.

Carry on.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 5:21 pm 
Hero
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One force level. The shield and the opponent get one force level.

To some extent, I let my opponent tell me how hard is hard enough, but he doesn't get to pick and chose. He gets one force level everywhere.

If you need to swing your sword like a baseball bat for them to take it on the shield, wait till the bout is over and as calmly as possibly talk to them.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 6:48 pm 
Warrior
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This is real........

Sleeper, I had a red with a tip that was already halfway blown out. I expected it to last 2 days at rag. It lasted until Saturday. Why? because I dont make excuses about "people backpedaling"

Forkbeard.......YOUR GOING TO RAG!?!

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 9:26 pm 
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McFinn I thought you were dead. Or, you know, no longer active.


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 10:08 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 7:45 am 
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A penny for thought, or two, I have fought some of the men posting in this forum, some I have not, but have come to respect the knowledge they possess a great a deal and look forward to fighting them someday.

That being said I would like to say that I have fought red users that when they hit my shield (when I'm using one, and I'm not shooting them in the face!) it knocks me back or staggers me. You can tell when your fighting a good fighter when they fully expect to hit your shield and you feel them let up and pull back on the swing when connecting with meat 1st cent ... pay attention to where your hitting 1st, how hard your swinging 2nd.

I understand that sometimes ... your GOING to take a red shot to the chrome dome, and even your berries.

Sometimes its the opponents fault, sometimes its the red-users fault. My point is a good fighter will admit if its his fault, if I duck into a red shot I'm going to take full ownership of it. BUT, if you don't have the fighting prowess to know when you swing a red at a high corner of a shield you have a chance to smack that fighter in the face, guess who gets the blame for that one? That's just sloppy * poor fighting in my opinion. Were in Belegarth because we have a common love for medieval combat, not to maim our opponents because we are to stubborn and prideful to take good advice and practice it.

2nd cent.. Practice the advice again and again, its given now from experienced and well known fighters on the field and the forums, and trust me will benefit you in the long run.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 7:50 am 
Underling
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Forkbeard wrote:
Another thing I think you should consider is the fragile nature of real swords.
Real swords break if you fight stupid hard with them. Doing the wrong thing at the wrong time can bend, shatter, or just snap off a real steel blade. Part of fighting with large 2 handed swords in real life is doing it WITHOUT breaking it, so that you can continue to fight more people.
If you are tearing swords apart the way you say, you are definently doing it wrong.
I remeber your Edhellen redsword tip failure thread well. That was your fault for tip fighting.
Read, lean, then go out and work on being a netter fighter, not a harder hitter.
FB



i actually agree with fork... the world just got turned upside down! :eyes:
anyways as for how hard hits should be? this would be alot easier to deal with if people would not only take there shots but if the person throwning the shots would trust the integrety of the person being hit. a hits a hit and if you question whether it hit or not, take it. If you still have a problem with an individual after a fight ask them, be polite (at least the first time you approch the individual) and find out whats going on, on there end.

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Arrow, you're a douche.
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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 4:26 pm 
Hero
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Peanut of Loderia wrote:
McFinn I thought you were dead. Or, you know, no longer active.


Yep, me and Bobby McFerrin - dead as doornails. :)

I have been much less active on the forum when I realized I was repeating myself over and over. I'm amazed Cyric still answers questions on the Rule Question subforum instead of just posting links to the last five posts to ask the exact same question.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 6:52 am 
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Arrow wrote:
Quote:
. a hits a hit and if you question whether it hit or not, take it.

I completely disagree with this. All hits are not equal. Call light on light shots.
If you question whether you were hit or not, call light.
FB

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 10:55 am 
Hero
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Forkbeard wrote:
If you question whether you were hit or not, call light.
FB

Interesting take on it. I see the benefit of forcing others to hit harder; preventing the game from going soft, but I wonder if we might be better served to take questionable shots for honor's sake and then tell the person after, "hey it was borderline but clean, so I took it. hit better." or something to that effect. Don't get me wrong, light shots and grazes are still not valid, but for expediency and to prevent escalation of tit-for-tat rhino hiding because someone's ticked you didn't take their shot, I see value in taking a closely questioned shot if it happens only every so often. If a fighter is doing it a lot then its their problem and they need to learn to fight better.

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Just don't call it boffing/boffering. That's not what we do. We fight. With swords. To the sorta-death. I can't stand it when someone says boffering. Plus is means sexin' in the UK.



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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 11:45 am 
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This is a competative sport. If we were playing soccer, would you count it as a goal if the other team bounced a shot off your goal post? or would you count it if they hit your goalie and bounched it off him, but it didn't go in?
Bad shots don't count. Taking them does not teach the person to do it right.
And why do I give a **** if some one gets mad because I call light on them? I don't get mad when some one calls light on me. I try to deliver a cleaner, more accurate and harder shot the next time. I take it as an opportunity to learn to fight better. So should everyone else.

FB

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 2:44 pm 
Slayer
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I kinda see both sides of this. When fighting someone who's never met me, and who'll probably never meet me again, on a national field, I just **** take it. Teaching them to 'do it right' just isn't my priority. Sure, I wish for better opponents and all, but teaching every random dude I come across just isn't a higher priority than not having to hear whining from randos who think they hit me. Hit-taking causes panties to bunch so fast in this game, it's almost a joke. Just not worth it to me.

When fighting against friends or trainees, I'll call it light every time, and encourage them to hit harder/cleaner/with better form. People who will get something out of that lesson, or who are my priority, are just a whole different subset than random strangers. I'll also fight friends more methodically and with cleaner form so that they can see each step of the process.

Maybe treating random strangers as less worth my time than my friends is a bad attitude, I've often wondered about that. But, at the end of the day, it lets me get the most enjoyment out of events with the least whining about hit-taking, and the trainees I've worked with all learn and enjoy themselves.

For reference, I use this same approach in all fighting games I play.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2011 4:33 pm 
Underling
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I agree with slagar. On your own home turf training should be key, at least if you are competitive, for some this is not so, however for those who are practices should be geared towards having fun and getting better and learning to hit with sufficient force.
At events it is a different story. Your not there to train, your there to fight competitively and have fun. You should know enough about the sport to at least be able to play the game effectively and that means hitting correctly, safely, and with enough force. However i do try to er on the side of honorable, and if i personally feel it 9/10 times I take it even if it was really light. Id rather be known as someone who takes there shots than someone who's name is associated with rhino hiding.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 12:54 am 
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Ok, so my take on this being that I fight with a red / green club, so no flat hits. I feel sh!++/ about it but I chipped some ones tooth during practice because I did front a shot and he rushed into my real shot while it was just picking up speed. He was very quick. There was no way I could have put the breaks on with out knowing ahead of time or throwing some weak , skow shot. The trouble with fighting red us that people try to rush in around a shot, not knowing where exactly they or the shot is going. Basically playing at fight speed , not at choreography speed. Ive clipped a few people in the head, but ive pulled dozens of shots. It's a matter of timing rhythm and knowing whom your fighting. As for the shield bash... Most people I have encountered would rather argue than lose thier shield, especially since, with a red you have range on them. I'm a pretty decent size guy at 265# and 6' , muscle of course so I don't have too many people asking me to swing harder, but I've had some hits where I rocked a guy but made almost no sound for what ever reason, and the call 'no good' because they didn't hear it... Or my personal fave, when I hit a guys shield in to his face and he called light.... My guess, he needed the shield for protection. I found its a matter of education, communication, and skills. At the end of the day it is a game of honor. Play to the best of your character.


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:03 pm 
Underling
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It seems like this was a bit of a dead thread but I'll throw in my two cents. Odd shots happen all the time. You need to learn the people you're fighting against and keep your head. Usually I'll use spear or glaive and try to keep my shots light and in control. Most of the bad shots that get taken from me are torso shots that they block down instead of out. If a specific individual thinks your shots are too light on a regular basis you can go aside with them and see whether it's your shot or them not taking a valid one. On taking the shots it depends on location for whether or not I'll take a light shot. Grazing my arm is light but a light slash across the stomach i think of as disemboweling.


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 6:19 am 
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Celtic Christ wrote:
It seems like this was a bit of a dead thread but I'll throw in my two cents. Odd shots happen all the time. You need to learn the people you're fighting against and keep your head. Usually I'll use spear or glaive and try to keep my shots light and in control. Most of the bad shots that get taken from me are torso shots that they block down instead of out. If a specific individual thinks your shots are too light on a regular basis you can go aside with them and see whether it's your shot or them not taking a valid one. On taking the shots it depends on location for whether or not I'll take a light shot. Grazing my arm is light but a light slash across the stomach i think of as disemboweling.


If you're taking light ever, you're the cancer that's killing Belegarth.

Quit it.


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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 10:13 am 
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Arrakis wrote:
Celtic Christ wrote:
It seems like this was a bit of a dead thread but I'll throw in my two cents. Odd shots happen all the time. You need to learn the people you're fighting against and keep your head. Usually I'll use spear or glaive and try to keep my shots light and in control. Most of the bad shots that get taken from me are torso shots that they block down instead of out. If a specific individual thinks your shots are too light on a regular basis you can go aside with them and see whether it's your shot or them not taking a valid one. On taking the shots it depends on location for whether or not I'll take a light shot. Grazing my arm is light but a light slash across the stomach i think of as disemboweling.


If you're taking light ever, you're the cancer that's killing Belegarth.

Quit it.


well said.

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 2:41 pm 
Brute
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Location: Nashville
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Favorite Fighting Styles: Greatsword, nothing else.
Arrakis wrote:
Celtic Christ wrote:
It seems like this was a bit of a dead thread but I'll throw in my two cents. Odd shots happen all the time. You need to learn the people you're fighting against and keep your head. Usually I'll use spear or glaive and try to keep my shots light and in control. Most of the bad shots that get taken from me are torso shots that they block down instead of out. If a specific individual thinks your shots are too light on a regular basis you can go aside with them and see whether it's your shot or them not taking a valid one. On taking the shots it depends on location for whether or not I'll take a light shot. Grazing my arm is light but a light slash across the stomach i think of as disemboweling.


If you're taking light ever, you're the cancer that's killing Belegarth.

Quit it.

I disagree. Someone calls light on my shots, means I have to hit em harder and well, I can, but then I could break another arm....
I'd rather take light hits...

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 Post subject: Re: Redsword headshot.
PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:16 pm 
Warning: Knows Math
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Favorite Fighting Styles: No gimmicks.
Sleeper, breaking arms is winning.

I don't understand your position.


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