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 Post subject: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 8:25 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 5:52 pm
Posts: 19
Started Fighting: 15 Feb 2012
Realm: cali
Unit: v
Favorite Fighting Styles: bursty
if you believe that spear and shield is use less fine please say why though. For everyone else please list tactics moves or links to such that would help. The shield i will be using is a large coffin shield and the spear is 6'3 held about 1/4 to 1/3 of thee way up on the handle for distance skirmishing and i choke up to the half way point when rushed.


Last edited by jollybane on Mon Feb 20, 2012 8:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 8:30 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 5:52 pm
Posts: 19
Started Fighting: 15 Feb 2012
Realm: cali
Unit: v
Favorite Fighting Styles: bursty
* also im about 6'1 210 lbs decently agile very strong


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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 8:55 pm 
Brute
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Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2003 2:13 pm
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Location: SLC, UT (Acheron)
Started Fighting: 0- 0-1995
Unit: Gelf
There's a few reasons why this style of fighting doesn't work in Bel. The first one is that 1 handed stabs don't cause injury to an armored area. None. Single green all day, and you won't do squat. The second is that a spears stabby point makes it a bit hard to get a solid hit on a torso, never mind a skinny arm. Also, stabs don't go toward the 2 limb rule, so get lucky, take all of their limbs and your target is still alive, like the damned Black Knight.

If you want to play with a spear the best way is buckler strapped to your forearm and use the spear 2 handed. "Double Geens" go through armor, making and solid torso or * shot a kill. the buckler is mobile enough not to get in the way of your spearing, but can block arrows.

EDIT: Just so that you don't think I'm talking out of my *, I have tried a version of what you are talking about. I used to roll with a medium punch and a rapier (basically just a small 2' spear). It's fun to * around with, but it's REALLY hard to land a good shot, and with no way to hurt an armored target without dropping my shield to get my other hand on it, I did poorly. Still, I'd whip out that style for a practice or 2 every year, just for funsies.

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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 11:06 pm 
Toadie
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Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:43 pm
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Started Fighting: 30 Jul 2008
Best tip I can give? Fight in a realm that has house-ruled that the "single green doing nothing to armor" thing is stupid and unrealistic, and has revised it.

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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 11:29 pm 
Hero
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Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 10:50 pm
Posts: 1433
Location: St. George, UT
Started Fighting: 20 May 2009
Realm: An Tir Dearg - Realm Leader
Unit: War Wolves of An Tir Dearg
Favorite Fighting Styles: S&B, spear, longsword
I'll let a master speak for himself (taken from page 5 of the oldhat Green vs Armor thread):
Forkbeard wrote:
Right now, armor is worn by about 10%-20% of the field at any given event. MOST people do not wear it. Therefore most people you fight don't wear it.
Also, at practice, even less people wear armor. With all these armor-less fools running around, we STILL never really see more than a handfull of people trying to fight spear and sheild. Why, be cuase it is usefless on it's own in Bel combat.
It has nothing to do with armor. Its the weapons all the way. In real life , you can slash with your spear. You can hit with the but, you can brain people with the shaft and you can STAB TO THE FACE. Taking away all these attacks cripples the weapon style. Now add in that in real life you can hit people with your sheild and reder them unconsious and injure them badly. Now add in the fact that spear and sheild is really only effective in groups, like a phalanx, which we don't really do, you've basicly completely ruined the style.
All this amounts to the same cripling that quarterstaves go through in our game. In real life, it is a much more effective weapon than a Bel legal quarterstaff.
Have you ever tried to fight an un armored fighter with short spear and shield while they go S&B?
I have, several times. It one of the things I do at practice to keep me from ruining noobs. Until you have video of you owning everyone at your practice with this style you should drop it. It is an ineffective style for Bel and changing armor will not change it.

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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2012 3:17 am 
Hero
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I won't say fighting with a spear and a shield in the way you're describing is useless, but I will say it's uh... suboptimal for fighting successfully in Belegarth. You're basically sacrificing all the key benefits that a spearman or a shieldman has over other weapon styles. On the spear end of things, you're limiting your potential range, and your leverage with two hands. On the sword and board side, you lose a lot of mobility, versatility, and the ability to close.

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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2012 3:27 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2012 5:52 pm
Posts: 19
Started Fighting: 15 Feb 2012
Realm: cali
Unit: v
Favorite Fighting Styles: bursty
i actually measured my reach using a shield with a one handed thrust i still have a 10 foot reach.(counting rotating my body into stab not stepping forward though) This still seems like a huge advantage to me and when rushed i still have a good chance because of my shield, i just choke up on my spear shield check the arm and stab like crazy under shield or at legs.


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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2012 7:12 am 
Slayer
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Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 2:24 pm
Posts: 1179
Location: Champaign, IL
Started Fighting: 18 Oct 2006
Realm: Numenor
Unit: The Amyr
Favorite Fighting Styles: Sword and Board
I don't know what to tell you that they haven't already, dude. The reason nobody can give you any tips for this style is that literally every competitive fighter in our game has decided it's not worth their time. I tried it for a month or so, and I'm 6'3", 210, and fairly athletic. I beat up noobs and flurbs, and got my **** pushed in by even marginally competitive fighters. No amount of physicality can get you past the fact that everything about our rules cripples this style. To change our minds, we'd need to hear reports from Chaos Wars of you rocking it without getting owned. Video would be ideal, but word of mouth would be fine.

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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 12:33 am 
Toadie
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Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:43 pm
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Started Fighting: 30 Jul 2008
I recant my previous statement; the best thing I can say is try to make a bladed spear. I've seen nasty work done with a max-blue spear with a 13" blade, with or without shield. But yeah, just like with the quarterstaff, historical usage vs rules of the game make it difficult to use the fighting style effectively.

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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 3:01 am 
Hero
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Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:33 pm
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Location: Walla Walla, WA
Unit: Horde
Kasada, don't you think you'd be better off with a min-red and going punch and pie?

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 Post subject: Re: spear and shield tactics
PostPosted: Wed Feb 22, 2012 9:43 am 
Underling
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Location: Florida
Started Fighting: 13 Oct 2009
Realm: Florida
Unit: The Order
Favorite Fighting Styles: Great Sword
If you make it blue it doesn't have to be 24 oz. Easier to wield one handed.

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