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 Post subject: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 3:16 pm 
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Okay, so shortly after coming home from Winter War, me and Lachlan acquired some fiberglass golf shafts and decided it's time to build some **** light weapons. My plan(being the poor foamsmith that I am) is to see if Edhellen blade fries will fit the core, but if I order them, and they don't work, I'll be *.

So, will the blade fries fit? And if not, what others ways of going about this would you recommend? In general any advice for a golf shaft build would be much appreciated by the both of us.

(P.S I already searched the subject, so I know how fragile they can be, but I already bought the * things. May as well use them and hope for the best.)

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 5:05 pm 
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it probably won't work. Golf shafts taper, so you will have a lot of empty space at the tip for the core to rattle around in, which will lead to the tip shearing off. Alternatively, you can wrap foam around the core and turn it into a bat, but you'll have to cut the foam to account for it being tapered. You could also just build a box to make it one uniform size and build from there. Golf shafts aren't really new smith friendly.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 8:56 pm 
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Favorite Fighting Styles: Sword and Board, Florentine, Devilhand.
*. I'll have to pencil laziness out of my agenda.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:08 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 10:24 pm 
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To start with, yes you can make weapons out of golf clubs and yes you may have them last for a while, if you hit on the very bottom of the acceptable range.
However doing it as Patchiz suggests kind of defeats the purpose as you are adding a ton of weight to the tip to take out the taper. Also, they break down really quickly if you hit with a decent amount of force. I've broken more than one on my first swing, and I know I don't hit anywhere near the top of the spectrum.
If you're really dead set on making them, don't use blade kits, because as Cyric pointed out you'll burn through them really quickly. In all honesty the only thing I've ever seen last any amount of time was when they were made into a flail, and you actually try not to hit things with the shaft of it (something almost no one does).
IMHO, for good long term weapons, use some fiberglass, or thicker kitespar (bigger than the .505 for gods sake) for your weapons.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:22 pm 
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Last edited by Not Relevant on Sun Nov 10, 2013 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 11:41 pm 
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Ahh so you fill them with resin, therefore changing completely what you told this person. Going from a hollow core to a solid core makes a difference that will make something stand up longer, especially with certain types of resin. And yes, it does add enough weight to make using them vs. fiberglass or kitespar pointless. Your cores may last longer with the resin, but like he said, he can't be lazy with them.

Don't yell at me for not giving me any information about how you build, and don't assume everyone builds things your way.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 12:55 am 
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I guess you didnt read very carefully.in the first post i told him to fill them with fiberglass resin,I didnt change anything I told this person, I wasnt yelling at anybody, so if your feel goods got hurt because somebody knows more then you I am sorry but you came in telling this person that I was wrong and the way I build was wrong,so dont start pointing fingers at "yelling" at me.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 9:10 am 
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Sorry I made a mistake.
However everything I said outside of that still stands. You will still get better and easier results, especially from a beginner foamsmith, using more "standard" materials will not only keep that laziness he was fond of, it will give him some good habits. He can then use those habits when he tries more exotic things like tapered cores.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 9:10 am 
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Sorry I made a mistake.
However everything I said outside of that still stands. You will still get better and easier results, especially from a beginner foamsmith, using more "standard" materials will not only keep that laziness he was fond of, it will give him some good habits. He can then use those habits when he tries more exotic things like tapered cores.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 11:32 am 
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MY OPINION BASED ON MY EXPERIENCE ONLY- the tapered golf clubs work well, but only when built up to get rid of the taper and filled with epoxy, fiberglass resin or DAP. for a first run at slimline blades, i suggest building a standard blade on 2 3/8in fiberglass rods.

rough up and tape together 2 rods the total length of the weapon you're building. epoxy them together and come back tomorrow. build a normal blade so that the striking edge is on the 2-rod side of the core, as this gets rid of a lot of blade twist. use the excess fiberglass from cutting down the cores to build up the handle. this also gives you an oblong grip and more for the pommel to grab onto. my first attempt at this build design lasted 3 years before first repair and weighed exactly 1lb.


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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 1:54 pm 
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Thorbjorn wrote:
MY OPINION BASED ON MY EXPERIENCE ONLY- the tapered golf clubs work well, but only when built up to get rid of the taper and filled with epoxy, fiberglass resin or DAP. for a first run at slimline blades, i suggest building a standard blade on 2 3/8in fiberglass rods.

rough up and tape together 2 rods the total length of the weapon you're building. epoxy them together and come back tomorrow. build a normal blade so that the striking edge is on the 2-rod side of the core, as this gets rid of a lot of blade twist. use the excess fiberglass from cutting down the cores to build up the handle. this also gives you an oblong grip and more for the pommel to grab onto. my first attempt at this build design lasted 3 years before first repair and weighed exactly 1lb.

Putting two 3/8ths cores together is generally a bad idea, for a number of reasons. I've definitely made that mistake before. But again, just my experience. To be honest, while I've heard bad things, I've never actually used golf shafts as cores, so I can't really give a lot of input, beyond saying that 1/2 fiberglass is a staple, or of course if you are looking for the lighter weapons, kitespar. I don't know how heavy the liquid fiberglass is than normal fiberglass.. but I think someone finding that out would probably be the quickest way to end the "it's heavier" vs. "no it's not heavier" argument that's being repeated above :p.

And one more quick thing to be said, while I'm sure a lot of you have put a lot of thoughts into building your weapons, experience attests to a lot in this sport as well. Cyric and Davit have been fighting a lot longer than we have, so even if you don't entirely agree with them, best at least take into consideration their advice.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:29 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Mon Dec 12, 2011 2:42 pm 
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Honestly.



I can build 8 oz sticks on .524 kite with barley boxes and 2# MC. That's finished weight. I don't, of course, because I like fat handles and counterweighted sticks.

Just buy some kite and fries.


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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:10 am 
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Here's the advice of someone who is in the same boat as you, only slightly farther along. I have now made two weapons with graphite golf club shafts. You may already know this, but DO NOT use driver shafts. I have made both mine with pitching wedge shafts and they have thicker walls. I did not fill them with restin - altho that sounds like a good idea. Personally I think this defeats the purpose of making a light weapon.

The first one did quite well and never broke. I did not account for the tapering, tho, and the tip eventually separated from the box. I may reuse the core and try again. The second one was a club. I capped it with a dime and wrapped duct tape around the tip until it almost reached the dime's edges. Then wrapped tape in various degrees around the rest of the shaft until the diameter was more or less uniform. I then proceded to wrap the rest of the foam and stabby it. I have used it for one practice so far and it has blocked reds and not had an issue.

It has been my expereience that if you fight using correct methods and body mechanics, you can use a weapon for along time before it breaks. The only weapon I have ever broken was PVC. Any other weapon I have had to discard was because of foam wear or foam/build realted issue, not core.

People who have negative things to say about a certain build technique have usually had bad experiences with it (it's the same reason I try to discourage people from buying Fords). Remember, each build is different and each fighter is different. I say, as long as it's safe, experiment. Have fun with it - use those cores and give it a try. But always have a tried and true backup.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:39 pm 
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DO NOT USE GOLF CLUB SHAFTS AS CORES.
THEY SUCK AND WILL BREAK.
iF YOU MODIFY THEM NOT TO BREAK, THEY COST MORE THAN GOOD 1/2" SOLID FIBERGLASS.
AND THEN THEY STILL BREAK.
This has been an Uruk-Hai public service announcement.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 12:58 pm 
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Forkbeard wrote:
DO NOT USE GOLF CLUB SHAFTS AS CORES.
THEY SUCK AND WILL BREAK.
iF YOU MODIFY THEM NOT TO BREAK, THEY COST MORE THAN GOOD 1/2" SOLID FIBERGLASS.
AND THEN THEY STILL BREAK.
This has been an Uruk-Hai public service announcement.
Arrakis wrote:
Honestly.



I can build 8 oz sticks on .524 kite with barley boxes and 2# MC. That's finished weight. I don't, of course, because I like fat handles and counterweighted sticks.

Just buy some kite and fries.


Well ****. Glad I only spent a dollar on those cores. lmao
Thanks for all the advice everyone, but it seems like the only way to make these cores last is to fill 'em with resin and that's a little bit more of a pain in the * than I need. I'm prolly about to abort this project altogether and begin the hunt for Kitespar.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:28 pm 
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http://www.goodwinds.com/merch/list.sht ... fiberglass

I like the FL-524L because I can cut them in half and get two 34.5" swords out of each piece OR cut them 34/30 and get a 32.5 and a 36.5from each stick.

The .602 is good for shortish (4-5 feet) javelins.


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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Tue Dec 13, 2011 10:19 pm 
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Nothing ventured, nothing gained. I have personally had mixed experiences with golf club shafts. My current golf-club sword has lasted ~6 practices (fingers crossed) with no problems and my golf-club club provided about 15 minutes of god-like speed before an epic core failure. Worst case scenario is that the core snaps after very little use. Since you already have the cores, there is no harm in using them; though I would recommend short handled- non hafted weapons (sword/tubesword). The best way I have found to compensate for the core's taper is to measure the diameter at the tip and bottom of the striking surface and cut pieces accordingly for the box.
The two blade layers are cut to match the widest part of the box layer and allowed to hang over either side of the tip.


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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Wed Dec 14, 2011 10:07 am 
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fill them full of fiberglass resin and they will last along time I have using mine for over a year now and have had no problems what so ever.Even when you fill them full of resin they are exstremely fast it doesnt really add that much weight to them. Like I said befor I stll have to add weight to make weight. I prefer them to fiberglass. good luck.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Wed Dec 14, 2011 12:02 pm 
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scottsman wrote:
fill them full of fiberglass resin and they will last along time I have using mine for over a year now and have had no problems what so ever.Even when you fill them full of resin they are exstremely fast it doesnt really add that much weight to them. Like I said befor I stll have to add weight to make weight. I prefer them to fiberglass. good luck.



How.

Much.

Exactly.

In decimal ounces.

Do they weigh per foot?


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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 3:17 am 
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My primary cheesy ultralight is a reblade fry on a golf shaft. I used grip tape to wrap the tapered end until it was a close-enough-to-even cylinder. It's been a phenomenal sword, and it's holding up very well so far.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:14 pm 
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Arrakis wrote:
http://www.goodwinds.com/merch/list.shtml?cat=fiberglass.tubularfiberglass

I like the FL-524L because I can cut them in half and get two 34.5" swords out of each piece OR cut them 34/30 and get a 32.5 and a 36.5from each stick.

The .602 is good for shortish (4-5 feet) javelins.


A pair of 34.5 inch swords? Sounds like a * fine flourentine set to me.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Tue Dec 20, 2011 12:26 pm 
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it taks about a half a cup,dont know how many decimel ounces that is, If I us a pitching wedge and fill it with resin, it weights about 6-7 ounces, thats prety light, rmeber when you fill theshaft, do it slowly and remeber to tap it on the ground to get the air bubbles out. i dont care what anybod saysif don correctly youll be reblading the sword befor replaceing the shaft.
If you ned or really want to know how resin it will take, fill the shaft with a masred amount of water till its full.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 8:42 am 
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scottsman wrote:
If I use a pitching wedge and fill it with resin, it weights about 6-7 ounces, thats prety light


No, it's not. A 40" piece of .524 kitespar from Goodwinds, which even Dagganoth has yet to snap, weighs less than 4 oz.


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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2011 10:31 am 
Toadie
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:idea:


Last edited by Not Relevant on Sun Nov 10, 2013 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2012 5:41 pm 
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Liam_McClung wrote:
So, will the blade fries fit? And if not, what others ways of going about this would you recommend? In general any advice for a golf shaft build would be much appreciated by the both of us.


Being an amtgard I have a little experience using golf clubs (having built well over 100 golf club swords) I do not recommend them for flat blades, even building up the tip to the proper diameter, your not going to get a clean enough connection without several hours of effort and lots of trial and error.

IF you want to constantly change your blade out, as in after every single use at belegarth, you could go with funnoodle. (if your from Cali bel, it will last awhile) if not, it most likely wont last the day.

My first and last attempt at using golf clubs for bel, I used a rolled foam technique. Building the tip up a little, adding some dense sticky-backed MC to try and even out the diameter of the core. Then, with spray glue (its Cali, good DAP was hard to find back then) I rolled 1/4 camppad foam until the weapon was just about 2.75 inches around. I covered the entire weapon in tape (its an amtgard thing... I know) used a cover, and the majority of them weighed in at around 8 ounces. (36 inches long) So, I put a good amount of counter weight on the handle/pommel to get to 12.1 ounces. I built around 25 of these for battle of the ring 2 years ago. Most of them are still usable, only really having to rebuild stab tips. A couple the glue didn't hold well and that caused them to tip out around the first 4-6 inches.

I would not recommend using this design in bel, unless you don't have access to better cores. I do think its the best way to use golf clubs for a core in belegarth though. If I absolutley had to use gold clubs again, I would try to find MC pad or yoga mat instead of the 1/4 camp pad and I would ofcourse use the good DAP.


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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 11:11 am 
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My tutorial for making quick tubes from Shield foam and putting them onto golf cores (though you can do it to any core if you make the routered hole the correct size) done as part of our Amt-kingdoms A&S workshop series:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQ_DUJp2dTY&list=UUTAWLmsa93a-JW0z2OCSTFQ&index=2&feature=plcp


Last edited by Fitz Caliston on Tue Feb 21, 2012 4:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Sun Feb 19, 2012 1:20 pm 
Grunt
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Uploaded video was named omni-blade, but actually taught how to put a center grip handle in a plank shield.

Good video, just not for omni-blade swords.


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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Mon Feb 20, 2012 11:43 pm 
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:idea:


Last edited by Not Relevant on Sun Nov 10, 2013 10:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Golf shaft build advice
PostPosted: Tue Feb 21, 2012 4:28 pm 
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evil randy wrote:
Uploaded video was named omni-blade, but actually taught how to put a center grip handle in a plank shield.

Good video, just not for omni-blade swords.


Doh! grabbed the wrong one. just edited the link, should work now.


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