Belegarth

Is it legal to have a jav with a spear hook, and how does one go about making one, so that its as safe as possible, if it is legal? I searched around, but havnt found much one way or the other on the subject. I've made a spear hook on a short spear, that didnt anywhere near make weight for a jav, and I'm now wanting to make a similar but much lighter weapon, to also have the ability to occasionally throw it, but, the weaker more flexible core wouldnt be handy, if the hook makes it illegal to throw.

Any information about this would really be handy.

No, that is not legal.
Javlins are Javlins. Spears can have hooks though.
I just made a very slick pole hammer with a gnarly hook on it that strong enough to hang from.
FB

It's not explicitly illegal, but in practice. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that it's pretty much impossible to build a shield hook on to a javelin while keeping that javelin otherwise safe. They're pretty much mutually exclusive. Just build a spear and pick up a javelin off the ground if you need to throw one.

Thanks guys, appreciate it, saved me alot of time and some foam, being able to ask you guys and get a quick answer.

Forkbeard wrote:I just made a very slick pole hammer with a gnarly hook on it that strong enough to hang from.

I'm going to want to see how that pole was made. Bring it to next Saturday practice?

Next one im at.
It might be a few weeks, im going out of town.
FB

Javelins with shield hooks are legal they just have to be padded safely enough all over so as to not risk injuring anyone when thrown.

Have you ever seen in done? I am thinking....given the right foam, I could treat the hook as the same as the core, pad it the same way, and make it safe for getting hit in the face, though, a bit less effective as a hook. Then, the flexibility of the core kinda comes into play, too flexible of a core=waste of time hook, and too heavy of a core=fail for weight.

If you could tell me how to go about it, or at least, how someone with some foam smithing skill would go about it, keeping it under weight, useful, and safe, I'd really appreciate it.

No. Just no.

Hooks have to be made strong enough to pull with, and that means either dense (harder) foam, or lots of tape. Javelins, to be safe, need to be light and have soft foam at the tip. Adding a hook to one side is going to throw off the aerodynamics of a javelin and make it terribly inaccurate, and a lot of people are going to be hit with the some part of the javelin other than the soft squishy head. Like it was said before, not technically illegal, but pretty much impossible to make safely.

Echoing Cyric (and myself) here. It's just not going to be possible to do in a way that is (in order of priority)

1) Safe - In order to make a shield hook that is durable enough to not pose a hazard when it's ripped off the haft, you'll need to make it significantly denser than normal haft padding via heavier foams and/or excessive tape. This same density poses a pretty big risk for facial injury on a javelin. Additionally, I don't believe it would be possible to make a javelin under the weight limit while maintaining the integrity of the hook.

2) Durable - This is because of pretty similar reasons listed above.

3) Effective - The added flex in a javelin will render it all but useless as a spear hook. On the other side of the coin, the extra weight at the head will cause it to function poorly when thrown.

With all that said, as it's not technically illegal, if you really, really want to ignore all this advice and try it out, you're free to do so. I should warn you that it's going to be difficult if not impossible to meet those above three conditions (well, really only the first two are all we care about as weapons checkers) and you should expect significant scrutiny and criticism before most people will accept such a weapon for use on the field.

Really, your best bet in this situation is to make yourself a well constructed 6-8 ft. low profile spear with a solid hook and a four or five foot kitespar javelin instead of trying to combine two very effective weapons and sacrificing exactly what gives that effectiveness in the process.

most definately, I hear you. I was looking for a challenge, something difficult to make, but, a hooked javvy isnt difficult, its impossible to do, if I want something useful at the end of the project. Think for my challenge, I'm going to try to make a max length jav that flies straight, and just keep tinkering till I get one that flies straight. I've heard of people putting fins on javs for stability...but, I've never seen it, and thats another one thats eluding me as how to make safe and durable. I know that's a different subject, but, is the fins for stability bad for the same reasons as a hook?

No. It doesn't generally create a safety issue. They're difficult to make durable and generally don't improve the flight characteristics in any significant way. Javelins don't really fly far or fast enough to benefit from stabilizers, which is why they're not seen very often.

Thanks, appreciate the info. Guess there's a reason all the javs look about the same, lolz. I'm trying to learn as much as possible, about weapon construction, and you guys are being incredibly awesome in helping me with that, I appreciate it a ton.

You should probably work on getting the fundamentals first before you try to change the world. Chances are if you come up with a new idea, someone has already tried it before. Check the search function.

newbiefourtyseven wrote:most definately, I hear you. I was looking for a challenge, something difficult to make, but, a hooked javvy isnt difficult, its impossible to do, if I want something useful at the end of the project. Think for my challenge, I'm going to try to make a max length jav that flies straight, and just keep tinkering till I get one that flies straight. I've heard of people putting fins on javs for stability...but, I've never seen it, and thats another one thats eluding me as how to make safe and durable. I know that's a different subject, but, is the fins for stability bad for the same reasons as a hook?

Alric of Drentha's made some max-length javs that he uses as throwable short-spears. Shoot him a PM; he's a good dude and I'm sure he'd be willing to give you pointers.

Edit: Derp, just remembered Alric plays Dagorhir mostly, and their javvie weight limit is different from ours. Still, he'd be worth looking up - I know he's made 13oz 7' spears before.

I put all-tape stabilizing fins (like the fletchings on an arrow) on my javelins, at the pommel.
Your results may vary, but even fins only extending an inch out from the padding makes my javelins fly better than without.

Dagganoth wrote:I put all-tape stabilizing fins (like the fletchings on an arrow) on my javelins, at the pommel.
Your results may vary, but even fins only extending an inch out from the padding makes my javelins fly better than without.

FTFY.

Oh man, I remember this one kid in Tir Na nOg was putting mini turbines in his. Carried around 10 or more in a sheath on his back. Used to throw Javelin in track, so he was obviously a master. Wore leather pants. Wore a giant musketeer hat, feather-and-all not just at practices but just around on the town. Yeah. That guy.