Blazoning Heraldry

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Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Tiberius Claudius » Mon Oct 31, 2011 11:44 pm

Anyone here an expert? Dedicated enthusiast?

Unit mate of mine created this heraldry:
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and I attempted to come up with the blazon:
Party per pale tenné and vert;
in chief a coronet, gules, between, dexter, a bugle-horn carnation, and, sinister, a crosier gules and carnation;
in fess a tower carnation, between, dexter, a horse rampant brun, mane or, tail gules, and, sinister, a horse rampant brun contourny, mane gules, tail or;
in base, centered, four claw marks, to sinister chief, gules.


Thoughts and criticisms? I know he put some colors on colors which is a faux pas, but I'm mostly looking to see if the description is intelligible and what can/should be tweaked.

Thanks!
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Arrakis » Tue Nov 01, 2011 2:42 pm

First up: That looks ridiculous. It breaks every rule and guideline of heraldry at least twice. The rule of Tincture is violently and flagrantly disregarded. It will look muddy and indistinct on the field and people will hate on it. The background of course shouldn't be black and that might help this not look so dumb.

As regards your blazon, you can't just name two colors and expect that a charge will be drawn the way you want it, but then, you normally don't specify colors of bits of a charge (excepting some parts of some animals); you need to note which parts are what colors. And be consistent. You can drop "Party" from the top line; it's superfluous with "per pale". "Contoury"? Where and what? The claw marks are not "gules", they're gules with some kind of argent bordure or something. Is the coronet being embattled and brick-looking important?


Simplify, simplify.

If I can help simplify this so it's not such an "I am heraldry and you can, too!", please let me know.
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Cedric » Tue Nov 01, 2011 6:41 pm

color on color is not faux pas, its the first rule, and you don't break the first rule.
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Tiberius Claudius » Tue Nov 01, 2011 8:40 pm

Thanks Arrakis, when I was writing the blazon I was working off of a thumbnail because I had to circumvent my work's internet filter that says pictures are the devil's tools. I see the extra colors on the claws, horn, and tower now.

As far as "contourny", that goes up with the sinister horse in fess since its facing dexter; normally all animals face sinister. Should I place it elsewhere? It was a normal line break in the format for the forum.

Lastly, here's the rationale behind all the symbols. Tincture notwithstanding, would you choose the charges and ordinaries differently?

The two base colors on the shield represent my desire to bring glory and honor to my realm (orange), and my loyalty for those I love (green). The fact that I divided the base colors in two equal halves represents the balance I have to make between my desires and my duties/obligations.

The tower in the center represents the Western Tower, which is the symbol for Barad'dun. The colors are the closest approximation of the RA colors that I could manage. The location is chosen to indicate what is the center focus of my House.

The horses represent readiness for battle/performance of duty. The horse ramapnt (hooves in air), signifies my eagerness and enthusiasm. The fact that the horses are facing outward from the Barad'dun tower indicate my readiness to defend the honor of my realm from all threats. The color of the mane/tail signifies my enlistment in the RA, while the brown indicates my commoner background.

The horn, crown, and staff represent the Marshal, the King, and the Shepherd, respectively. Like the Tower and Horse, they are in RA colors. Their position on the shield represents their authority over Barad'dun, and me. Note that the crown depicted does not represent royalty (it is a crown mural, not a cornet), and neither is it represented above the heads of either horse. This is done to avoid a stranger making the mistake of thinking I was royalty.

The claw marks in the center base, of course, represent my Blood Brother status. The location of the claw marks, beneath the Barad'dun Tower and the horse hooves, represent the reliance upon the War Wolves' support that both Barad'dun, and I, have come to rely.
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Arrakis » Wed Nov 02, 2011 5:11 pm

It would be, I think, preferable to use fewer charges and more divisions and/or ordinairies to indicate these fealties; for example, an embattled chief of red to show fealty to the crown with some manner of symbol on it to show the other two fealties. Honestly, those three fealties (King, Law, Country) are redundant to show, as any knight or sworn lord would have, as a matter of course, been loyal to those principles and offices. That could free you up the entire chief, perhaps to put the tower there as Lord (highest charge) of the shield, which then frees you up some room to make the horses not look so distorted and overlarge. The claw marks should either be a major focal point (a quarter-field or better) or removed in favor of a representative division or ordinary.

Remember that you want heraldry to be instantly identifiable from long distances, as that was its prime purpose and that purpose defined and distinguished the very art of heraldy. Any idiot can slap symbols and colors on a canvas; heraldry is more than that. It's art with a purpose.



For more blazoning advice (like what order to blazon things in), read everything on this page: http://museum.worldwidesam.net/reenactm ... index.html
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Tiberius Claudius » Thu Nov 03, 2011 9:23 am

Thank you much; I'll pass this on.
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Mefit the Merciless » Tue Nov 15, 2011 5:21 pm

Cedric wrote:color on color is not faux pas, its the first rule, and you don't break the first rule.


I thought the first rule of heraldry is "you don't talk about heraldry".....
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Torix » Fri Dec 16, 2011 11:17 pm

Mefit the Geek wrote:
Cedric wrote:color on color is not faux pas, its the first rule, and you don't break the first rule.


I thought the first rule of heraldry is "you don't talk about heraldry".....


Is there an actual list of rules?/Where might i find such a list?
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby No'Vak » Sun Dec 18, 2011 11:32 pm

Vercingetorix wrote:
Mefit the Geek wrote:
Cedric wrote:color on color is not faux pas, its the first rule, and you don't break the first rule.


I thought the first rule of heraldry is "you don't talk about heraldry".....


Is there an actual list of rules?/Where might i find such a list?



Arrakis posted a link. I don't know why vercingetorix would want one of these though.
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Torix » Mon Dec 19, 2011 7:33 pm

No'Vak wrote:

Arrakis posted a link. I don't know why vercingetorix would want one of these though.


Just curious.
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby Porthos » Wed Dec 21, 2011 8:35 pm

I would like to point out a couple things.

1) Belegarth Heraldry breaks the rules in favor of what looks "good" to one person or a group. While your arms that you presented here are not in line with heraldic "rules", if you like it, and it looks good to you, be down. I applaud the want to be historically accurate, but do not feel like you have to be. I'm sure this is an obvious sentiment, but I just want to put it out there. Also, while I understand you're trying to be correct, but there *are* examples of rules violations.

2) Its busy. Yes, I know, we're not the SCA, however, a rule of thumb that I was told, and is pretty reasonable, is keep it to 6 or 7 things, at max. Color, color, metal, charge, border, countercharge, etc. It does keep things simple.

3) You might want to look into countercharging. Its a great way to be visually striking. Also, while it *is* getting ornate, there are always the options of supporters bearing additional charges to convey the symbolism you wish to convey.
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Re: Blazoning Heraldry

Postby No'Vak » Thu Dec 22, 2011 12:28 pm

Vercingetorix wrote:
No'Vak wrote:

Arrakis posted a link. I don't know why vercingetorix would want one of these though.


Just curious.


Was just referencing where your name came from ya gaul :P.
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