Halfswording: A tempist in a teapot?

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If you use half-swording style maneuvers, do you grip the striking surface of your blade?

No, my blade is single sided, contains haft-padding or has some other legal surface I can grip.
3
23%
Yes, I regularly grip the striking surface of my weapon
7
54%
No, I don't use half-swording style maneuvers but felt like voting anyway
3
23%
 
Total votes : 13

Halfswording: A tempist in a teapot?

Postby Thomas MacFinn » Sat Dec 22, 2007 12:42 am

Magpie of Rhûn wrote:I admit that different people play this sport in different ways, but I firmly believe that the rules as they are (i.e., not changed) already allow for halfswording. I think this is good, and regularly incorporate it into my fighting style. (though my sword IS single-sided anyway).


I also happen to own a single sided blade. It occured to be that a properly padded striking surface is difficult to get a grip on and wondered, is anybody out there actally used half-swording as we have been discussing or is this is a purely theoretical discussion? Is there anybody out there that actually regularly grabs the striking surface of their weapon?

To clarify my position on the matter I believe that the current rules, as written, allow half-swording but that they shouldn't in the name of fairness.

Any portion of a blade that is dull enough for you to grip should be dull enough for an opponent to grip and there is nothing preventing a weapon smith from putting incidental padding instead of a striking surface for a foot or more past the crossguard of a red weapon or creating a single edged weapon for all or a portion of the weapon's length.
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Postby Sir_Mel » Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:01 am

I half sword with a double bladed sword all the time. Of course, I have pretty big hands but since there is a historical precedent for this and it happens to be a pretty successful technique for me, I would be very sad if somebody decided to make this illegal.
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Postby Thomas MacFinn » Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:23 am

In many games, people spend a lot of time asking the author to make judgment calls about gray areas in the rules. Some gaming periodicals have devoted regular columns to these kinds of questions. In Belegarth, there is no single author to pester but "Spirit of the Rules" still works fairly well because the guiding principles are pretty well known: safety, realism and playability.

Regarding half-swording, is this an accurate summary of the arguement so far?

Rules:
3.7.5. Gripping the striking surface of an opponents Weapon results in the disabling of that limb.

For: The use of the word "opponents" is intentionally included to allow half-swording
Against: The wording is incidental and this sentence does not imply that half-swording is allowed

Safety:
For: Weapons are inspected prior to every event and half-swording does no significant damage to striking surfaces compared to everyday abuse that owners put their blades through (like storage in hot cars)
Against: Half-swording can tear up foam

Realism:
For: Half-swording existed historically. European swords did not have to be sharp to chop people in two
Against: A sword dull enough to permit half-swording is also dull enough to be grabbed.

When interpreting rules (whether here or elsewhere), I see three schools of thought:
1) Spirit of the Rule - when in doubt, try to divine the author's intention or guiding philosophy
2) Anything not explicitly approved is banned.
3) Anything not explicitly banned is allowed.

I see nothing in the rules to lead me to believe either #2 or #3 is a part of the Belegarth system.
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Postby Big King Jimmy » Sat Dec 22, 2007 1:06 pm

I think it's important to denote the difference between half sword swings and parrys. Although if further complicates the issue I've never applied force to the blade to swing. However swinging with your hand on the blade will almost never be allowed, because it's akin to a punch weapon, anytime the striking surface in front of your hand is used to strike, that IS a rules violation. However, in single blue a regularly place my blade in my off hand to parry.
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Postby The Lost Celt » Sun Dec 23, 2007 8:55 pm

I can see where parrying comes into play and I've seen this practiced fairly regularly, where it comes to a quarrel is some people feel that an opponent grasping a double edged blade to parry is akin to anvilling or that the force of the strike would be redirected to a non-target area - some people to allieviate that turn the blade on it's side so they're not grasping a striking surface - that's where it can damage a blade.

All the examples you listed however wouldn't bother me a bit, except the notion that an opponent could grab that weapon - unless it's like a haft padding or somesuch I don't want anyone touching my weapon, but the real problem is when I try to pull away and they grip harder.
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