Tactical Exercise 3

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Tactical Exercise 3

Postby Kyrian » Mon Apr 17, 2006 6:43 pm

Here's the notation I came up with. Hopefully, it will be a lot more clear than trying to use text representations. Please let me know if you have any suggestions:

Image

Just to sum up,
a) Size of the unit is denoted by the size of the rectangle.
b) Unit type is denoted by the rectangle's line weight.
c) Unit experience level is denoted by the number of chevrons.
d) Unit style (line, skirmish) is denoted by broken or solid line.

I. This is a large-scale Many versus the Few.

II. Red forces.
--a. Large unit of heavy skirmishers with high experience (40)

III. Blue forces.
--a. Small unit of medium line fighters with low experience (19)
--b. Small unit of light line fighters with medium experience (19)
--c. Small unit of light skirmishers with low experience (19)
--d. Small unit of light skirmishers with low experience (19)
--e. Small unit of light skirmishers with medium experience (19)

IV. Organization (from blue force perspective)

Image

V. 00:10 Realizing that it would get crushed in a stand-up fight, Red force immediately splits off into 4 units of 10 to better utilize their mobility:
Image

You are the Blue Force commander. What are your orders?
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Postby Faolan » Tue Apr 18, 2006 2:33 pm

I would have "e" flank mostly cause they have the most expeiriance (can't spell) and have the best chance of staying together and staying alive. The experianced fighters keep the new guys from getting killed is a help too. They encircle small groups of reds and kill them fast. Picking their battles and creating confusion.

Have "a" and "b" team up the veterens taking advantage of the protectoin of the armor wearers and using "b" 's support weapons to hold off resistance from red teams. Seeing as red is skirmishers with small or no shields polearms come in handy. The "ab" group heads off to the right slowly catching up with "e". "ab" will eventually join with "e" and attack from the rear/flank.

"c" and "d" will eventually team up but use small flanking manuvers as the oppurtunity presents itself. Seeing as they are inexperianced and light skirmishers I don't expect much from them, but if they can team up than good for them. If they manage to pull together than they shall regroup were the fight is strong and help out there. After that basic flanking manuvers on the left.

My two cents....
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Postby Fowler » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:11 pm

Always:
Order E to go right and head towards the very edge of Red's right flank.
Order C to go left and head towards the very edge of Red's left flank.
Order B to go towards the gap between Red A & B
Order D to go towards the gap between RED C & C
Order A to give me a thin line between my units B&D with more guys on the left edge.

IF:
Should Red stand their ground
C presses the outside of Red A.
E presses the outside of Red C.
B hits the rear/side of Red A.
A presses Red B to Allow both my C & B to do their work.
All the while D&E will hold the attention of both C's- or Die by the work of both Red C's.
I expect Red B to fall easily against the might of my C,B and A.
Then my C,B,A team will attack the Red Team or flank them if my right flank is still alive.

This basic strategy can be performed numerous ways- as long as I have the position of units I describe above. The above strategy should always protect the flanks of my units and allows me to take advantage of my numeral surperiority.

IF:
If Red A tries to go around my left flank my unit C- C breaks off and follows Red A.
If Red C(far right one) tries to go around my right flank unit my unit E breaks of and follows.
my unit B will press Red B on the outside and my unit D will press Red C on the outside- A will split in half and hit the side-rear of C & B as they fight B&D.
Once my B,D,A has done their thing they go after the left overs.
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Postby Kyrian » Tue Apr 18, 2006 4:44 pm

Sorry for the confusion. That Red c on the far right should be a Red d. It's been corrected.

I'm going to go with Fowler's development of the battle:

Image

Just to turn things around, if you were the Red commander, how would you respond?

Some things to keep in mind:
1) As a whole, you have more armor than the blue forces.
2) You are significantly outnumbered (2.5 to 1).
3) Your flanks are being contained by the far right and far left blue forces.

P.S. How is this notation working? Does it help?
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Postby Mercer » Tue Apr 18, 2006 4:52 pm

Scissor in with Red a and b on Blue b, and Red c and d on Blue d. This give superiority in number (barely), armor (substantial), and experience (considerably), attacking from separate directions. If one of the Blue targets turns to face an attacker, the other takes them from behind.

If this is successful, you've got 2 reconsolidated forces of 20 (minus any losses) against 3 less-experienced forces unable to link back up. You can then move to eliminate the center force together, or separate to hit the flankers before taking on the center.
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Postby Kyrian » Tue Apr 18, 2006 5:14 pm

Using Mercer's reply: Counting on the inexperience and lack of armor of the blue forces, Red forces launch quick, decisive attacks on Blue b and Blue c.

Image

There were minimal casualties to Red forces (basically some armor lost and a few gimps) and the three remaining blue units:

Image

Blue commander, your orders?
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Postby Grim Warhawk AlRitte » Tue Apr 18, 2006 6:25 pm

I'd pull A southeast below red C and D and slanted left,
move E north and near the middle of red C and D,
move C south between red A and B

THEN engage E to the north sides of C and D
engage C to the south sides of A and B
Advance A NW into the already skirmishing C and D's

C and E would not be engaging in full combat, but just distractions
A, being the only line unit on the field, would then take advantage of C and D being in a fight already and advance on them hopeing to wipe them clear of the field or force them back farther.

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Postby Fowler » Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:59 pm

Your notation works great.

As Blue commander I would chop off the heads of the leaders of units C, A & E for not taking the initiative and attacking the Red units already- then run for my life. Because if the battle was at this point, I wouldn't expect to win.

However, in Belegarth you don't do either so: My C attacks Red A and my E attacks Red D. A splits with half forces attacks B&C.

I would argue that Mercer's move would result in a crushing defeat- unless it was pulled off in 30-45 secs. The reason is that this move ignores 3 units and their possible reactions.

I would argue red should all at the same time.

Red A charges towards C- breaks to their right half way and hit C and slides off- going to the back field. This should tear a good piece of Blue C to pieces. If they fail to kill 8 blue troops of Blue C they should do a quick circle back as my Red B hits to insure Blue C's destruction.

Red B should sprint hard their right and then make a hard left turn- to hit the remains of C that would have just been hit by my A. This I hope eliminates Blue C. Red B continues into the back field.

Red A & B consolidate forces.

My Red C&D does the same maneuver as A&B except opposite directions.

This maneuver hopefully renders Blue's surperior numbers useless as they are left in the center too distant to engage my swift vet units.

I would argue that the inexperienced Blue B would attack my consolidated A&B and Blue D would attack my consolidated C&D. This would be the destruction of Blue B&D. Blue A would be eliminated by the hammer and anvil maneuver.
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Postby Grim Warhawk AlRitte » Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:16 pm

At this point in the battle, blue has lower numbers, lower armor, AND lower experience. They're screwed. My plan was designed to inflict as many casualties as possible to the red forces and HOPEFULLY allow some of my skirmishers to live by staying out of a full melee.
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Postby bo1 » Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:23 pm

Instead of that why not have Blue-C back off a bit to bait red A+b into a chase, using thier speed and relitive youngness to an advantage. If Red A+B leaves then Blue A+E squish Red C+D in a death pocket. If Red A+B turn to Blue A, then back stab them. Blue e should do the same.
The worst thing for blue is If red army as a whole, which they probibly would given their experience, splits with Red B+C attacking Blue A, and the outer red groups engaging the Blue flankers just to keep them busy and not helping blue A then, blue should pull out to the south or north and reform, as they will not profit from this set of events.
i agree that blue is in a bad place but if red makes a mistake and doesn't finish well blue could instigate some pretty heavy losses.
Last edited by bo1 on Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Fowler » Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:25 pm

Grim Warhawk wrote:At this point in the battle, blue has lower numbers, lower armor, AND lower experience. They're screwed. My plan was designed to inflict as many casualties as possible to the red forces and HOPEFULLY allow some of my skirmishers to live by staying out of a full melee.


I agree and I like your idea.
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Postby Fowler » Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:29 pm

bo1 wrote:Instead of that why not have Blue-C back off a bit to bait red A+b into a chase, using thier speed and relitive youngness to an advantage.


The red are vets, not old. Because they are Vets I would expect them to give chase with only one unit and use the other unit to help eliminate your other two units. Banking on vets mindlessly chasing the enemy, would not work I think.
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Postby Kyrian » Tue Apr 18, 2006 9:53 pm

I would agree with Fowler. Since Blue A is a line unit, I would surmise that Red C and D would take advantage of this and immediately skirmish attack A, most likely by breaking off and hitting its flanks.

Image

Red C and Red D would probably have some people screening Blue E to prevent them from trying to backstab. This also would make it a bit more challenging for Blue E to try and eliminate Red C or Red D. Meanwhile, Red A and Red B would eliminate Blue C and then sweep left to also hit blue A. Image

Once Blue A has been eliminated, the remainder of the Red forces, which I'm guessing would number probably a minimum of 20-25 would focus on containing and taking out Blue E.

Image

If anyone has any ideas for future tactical exercises, feel free to post them. I also had this idea of possibly looking at actual historical battles and perhaps playing those out. I just found a pretty cool book for $15,

Battles of the Medieval World,

and I think it might be interesting to wargame some of these battles.
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Postby Fowler » Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:10 pm

This was very interesting.

You should throw some more stuff out!

I'm too poor to buy anything so feed us the good stuff from the book.
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Postby Grim Warhawk AlRitte » Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:40 pm

So just out of curiousity, was there anything blue could have done to win after that initial encounter? I realized after I made the pic of my plan I should have pulled blue C and E back for flank support on A. But givin the way things were set up, I didnt forsee red forces allowing me to retreat past them for any such plans. Also, considering almost all the blue forces were newbs they would have engaged in combat in the most direct fashion anyway.

Also, as a side note, blue A and E have no chance in hell of hammer and anviling 2 experienced heavy skirmisher units with equal numbers.
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Postby Mercer » Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:54 pm

I would argue that Mercer's move would result in a crushing defeat- unless it was pulled off in 30-45 secs. The reason is that this move ignores 3 units and their possible reactions.


The only reason I suggested it was that Red was all vets, opposing less-experienced forces. Only vets could pull it off with any surety, IMO. The intimdation factor, superior skills, and armor make for a daunting opponent, and the lesser experienced fighters might make a brief but damning hesitation to engage a "superior" force.
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Postby Kyrian » Tue Apr 18, 2006 11:16 pm

Grim,

I think it would've been extremely difficult for the blue forces to win unless they were able to firmly establish local numerical superiority on the groups of 10. This would have probably entailed trying to pin Red A and Red D against the battlefield boundaries and then detailing two units each (Blue b and Blue c, Blue d and Blue e) against those units. This would have pitted the red force unit of 10 against a total of 38 people. However, I'm guessing that 1) Red a would probably sweep back left and link up with b and Red d doing the same with c. 2) the combined Red A/B and Red C/D would focus on wiping out blue b and blue d in the process. Blue A might be able to shift around and help protect those units but since it is a line unit with low experience, it would probably get strung out in the process and picked off.
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Postby Fowler » Tue Apr 18, 2006 11:50 pm

Grim Warhawk wrote:Also, as a side note, blue A and E have no chance in hell of hammer and anviling 2 experienced heavy skirmisher units with equal numbers.


I assume you are referencing my response. There isn't equal numbers. There are 2 units of red that has already engaged a unit of blue and perhaps lost one or two men or have some gimped men. Either way even if the red units were 100% they would have placed themselves between two enemy units.

I suggested that Blue A split- so that is 9 medium line men attacking from one side and Blue C with 19 men attacking the other side. That is a total of 28 blue troops- not 20, they have surperior numbers.

The same goes for the group on the other side. Except one side of blue gets an extra guy.

I also think it is way too optomistic to think that the vets wouldn't lose some men to their initial maneuver. So I think it would be safe to assume that each Blue Hammer and Anvil is operating with 28 men and each Red group being attacked is operating at 18 men each. A clear numerical surperiority. In addition though Red are vet troops- I expect after their quick charge they are not in a well formed group when my units engage them.
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