Belegarth

This Sunday, I ran into a little problem while I was heralding and was wondering how you guys would handle this situation.
Archer is not using any sidearm.

A standard sword and boarder runs up to Archer.

Archer calls herself dead before they even make a strike.

This is not a big deal because I understand that archers tend to not want their bows broken.

However, it got to the point (throughout the entire day, might I add) that whenever someone would make eye contact and made a dead sprint towards her, she would call herself dead before they were even thirty feet away.

Needless to say this was * people off and got them yelling at her because they were ready to fight, exerted all that energy, and she didn't even make an attempt to survive.

The way I ruled on it was got on the fighters for their screaming and yelling, and told her that if you want to be able to hit other people, you have to allow other people to hit you, or at the very least run to someone on your team who can defend you.


Should this problem arise again, what would you all do in this situation?

The archer needs to understand that this full-contact game, they will get hit. If they cannot take shot, then I would question why they're on the field in the first place and even not allow them on the field. It's not like we're swinging steel or even rattan, they're padded weapons.

It's her perogative to call herself dead at any time. people shouldn't * about expending energy fighting, since that is what the game is all about.

The archer does sound like she needs to toughen up, but if she is taking herself out, no big deal.

If people are getting mad at expending energy NOT having to swing at the archer, you have some serious problems in that realm! Archers often call themselves dead when they come to the conclusion that they are gonna die. This is no problem, it saves gear and injuries. I think you did pretty much the right thing. I would not have gotten on the archer, rather I would have congratulated the archer for not trying to do something stupid in a no-win situation.

I'm gonna touch on some stuff that you guys have said, just to make sure that we're all on the same page.

Winfang, I agree but what would you say to the other fighters who are having a problem with her?

Cyric you said that "people shouldn't * about expending energy fighting, since that is what the game is all about" but their problem was the opposite. They were expending their energy and not getting to fight, which as you said is that the game is all about. I'm sure if they just wanted to run around, they'd take up track.

Also Freyson, you had mentioned the thing about people calling themselves dead when they know they're gonna be beaten. At events, there have been times when I find my most of my team dead and here comes 2 or 3 of the Galin Project. I either run to someone I can ally with or stand my ground if there's no help and I would like to think that most people in this sport would do the same.

I agree with you guys on the part where she can call herself dead so she doesn't get hurt, but I got the vibe from the her that this wasn't an "I don't want my gear broken or my body busted" call, but just not wanting to be hit by anyone.

I guess my real question here is, "At what point is someone calling theirself dead too much?"

Spike wrote:Cyric you said that "people shouldn't * about expending energy fighting, since that is what the game is all about" but their problem was the opposite. They were expending their energy and not getting to fight, which as you said is that the game is all about. I'm sure if they just wanted to run around, they'd take up track.

And you've never run up on someone only to have them get killed before you get there? it happens, and they need to get over it. It's only one kill that they're missing out on, and it may seem like a lot on a small field, but sometimes it happens.

There is nothing in the rules about calling yourself dead or not, so it's not really a marshal call. this is something a realm leader should be addressing.

I would tell the others to quit whining. If she's going to call herself dead, then use it to your advantage.

To add a little more back ground on the situation, the archer in the discussion is the type of individual who stands in one place during the entire battle and only moves to collect her arrows. She has also tried to keep fighting numerous times after she had called herself dead which is where a lot of tension toward this fighter has come from.

With that in mind, I'd make sure to reiterate it to the field when she calls herself dead, as a Herald.

"Did everyone hear that, so-in-so is Dead!"

And then take that spot next to where she stands as your new vantage on the field. Making sure she doesn't pull a Lazarus.

Otherwise, if she calls herself dead. It's her perogative, but feigning death or injury is specifically prohibited.

If she calls herself dead, and then keeps fighting, she's a bloody cheater, and should be booted off the field in steel toes.

It is specifically against the rules to fake death. If is is dead, less arrows to my face. If she fakes death, as a Hearld here I would tell them once that they cannot do that or go home. If they did it a second time I would not allow them to play for the rest of the night.

But calling dead from 30' away is fine enough with me.

Resurection is not cool by any standard (less it is a specific game that allows for it).

I know this hasn't been touched in a bit, but to add a bit of illumination:
We have a girl working on becoming an archer in our realm. (needs gear and such) She was fighting with us for a bit, but after a couple of practices, she found that some very real health problems from High School were flaring up again due to being bashed around by our foam. She very well could go either way when she becomes an archer (fraidycat archer or warrior archer,) but I wouldn't hold it against her to say "I'm dead" every time someone came within a few yards. Hell, I'd probably make it a priority to charge her at lay on, getting that one threat off of the field as quick as possible.

As for the "Play Dead" Archer, there are ways of keeping any player from doing that. As has been mentioned, as a herald, call her out on it, as a fighter, make sure to cap said corpse before she goes zombie. quick stab to each arm should do it if nothing else.

I would never want to turn someone away due to a medical condition or fear of being injured. Any fighter should have the right to call themselves dead at any time to avoid contact. There are many valid personal reasons for this.

Archers especially can call themselves dead. In my realm, it is actually a requirement, and we train our archers to fight and run while dropping there gear and pulling their aux weapons. This is because archery equipment is expensive, fragile, and it can easily fit in an eye socket, thereby removing an eye. The fact that these sharp plastic bits are on the field requires players exercise extreme caution when rushing archers.

The Jesus stunt should not be tolerated. Fixing this problem will hopefully reduce the tension against this fighter in your realm. But in all seriousness, how hard is it to kill an archer who doesn't run and doesn't have a weapon? Why are they frustrated that they don't get to hit her, did they doubt they could kill an unarmed and stationary fighter? It sounds like your "dudes" have an aggression problem. Tell them to fight someone on par with their weapons and skillz. It will make them better fighters, unless challenges frustrate them too.

-AoC

Anastasia of Chamonix wrote:I would never want to turn someone away due to a medical condition or fear of being injured.

I dispute this idea. If someone walks onto the field with a serious medical condition, it is the heralds responsibility to remove them. Be it a loose knee, or heart condition. The herald's responsibility is to ensure the safety of all of the participants on the field, including a fighter who is playing Russian Roulette with their body.

We recently had an issue like this occur at our practice. We were taking a water break when a couple of our guys started horsing around. Fighter X put Fighter Y into a loose sleeper hold, Fighter Y went down like a sack of bricks. We come to find out that Fighter Y has had 3 open heart surguries, and a host of other serious medical problems. Fighter Y is no longer allowed to fight on our field.

Yes, this is an extreme case, but if someone is on the field, you're going to get hit. Whether you're arching or not, calling yourself dead or not. Eventually, someone will sneak up on you and hit you. If you have serious medical conditions that do not allow the "Full Contact" part of our game to apply to you, or if your fear of being injured is such that you refuse to get hit, you should find another way to be a part of the community.

She has the right to call herself dead...any fighter on the field reserves that right. Hell, if theres 12 people coming at me and I'm the only one left, I could call myself dead...I don't, but that right exists. She DOES NOT have the right to continue to fight after she has called herself dead.
My suggestion is to make the dead put three points on the ground and completely drop their gear. Also, if she does the zombie regen crap, boot her from the field for a period of time, then walk over and explain exactly what she was doing wrong.
And Anna, it is frustrating, in the heat of the moment, when you're charging someone, for them to simply say "dead." Notice I said heat of the moment...as Winfang said, use it as a tactic to help your team remove an archer.

I would just like to point out for all those that haven't noticed: this thread is really really old. No one is disagreeing that she can't call herself dead.

Also, in no point anywhere did I mention that she was rezzing herself.

Yeah, I don't know why I wrote that. After re-reading my post, I realize I shoulda read the topic better.

Zi'gor wrote:To add a little more back ground on the situation [...] [s]he has also tried to keep fighting numerous times after she had called herself dead which is where a lot of tension toward this fighter has come from.

You all aren't insane, it just wasn't Spike who said it.

Now die, thread, die! We seem to be having a serious Solanum issue on the boards today.

As curiosity has gotten the better of me, does this archer still fight?

Of course not. People who don't want hit don't last long in a game based around hitting people.

EDIT: Dear god I necro'd D: I didn't check the dates on this abandoned forum....

I took up archery after a visit with the doctor rendered me unable to fight or participate in full contact sports where I may take hard blows to the chest or back.

When I first started I would call myself dead quite a bit, it is frustrating because it gives that feeling that an archer can simply sit at the edge of the field firing arrows of pain on everyone, and as soon as someone goes to hit them, they just flop over.

I believe an archer shouldn't just roll over.

Heretic even said to me once "Ugh dude can I just hit you ONCE." and I turned my back and he gave me a whop just to feel good about being able to. I get that.

I think it is within an archer's right to call themselves dead, but if we took away the ability to do so, theoretically standing in place and getting hit would hurt much more than trying to escape. I got in the habit too where I would just turn my back to them so they'd tap me and go, when in all honesty most times I could have escaped. I now try to sprint away, duck behind shieldmen, or call people "TO THE LEFT" or "RIGHT SIDE" so they know where the attack/bumrush is coming from.

I think it is a newbie archer thing more than it is a fraidycat thing?

Phoxly wrote:EDIT: Dear god I necro'd D: I didn't check the dates on this abandoned forum....

Fail Phoxly, just fail.

D: and I put so much effort into a well thought out post that adds to the discussion with no trollin!