Forkbeard wrote:But, you see, He only wants to get this rule put in so He and Isk can say their realm got a rule put in the books.
He does not really think it's ok to bash an archer, he's being a douche on purpose. To create an artificial need for the rule.
That is all this is about.
FB
Whoa, whoa, whoa...... back up here. That's not the case at all. Get your facts straight before you start running your mouth only so you can sound like a bad * Fork. Why on earth would that be anyone's reasoning for suggesting a rule change? Is your ego so big, your self esteem so low that you need to project your need for attention on others? Christ, man, now its you being an internet douche on purpose, as usual, and its wearing thin. Put your cape away; you can be the self-appointed guardian of the game as-you-see-it another day.
This topic came up at our practice on Wednesday when someone bashed an archer - Isk was against bashing archers and I was for it. He thought it was already in the rules and I knew it wasn't. Out of a desire to keep the practice moving and since a safety consideration was brought up, as Realm Leader, I temporarily banned shield bashing archers for the night until we could look it up in the Book of War.
Since its not in the rules, Isk came here to get consensus from the community so our Realm could be in-line with the national standards and to make a suggestion. I came here to actually voice against making it a rule not because I don't think we need more rules, but because I'm in favor of allowing it. I only posted a reason that it should be a rule as a help to a friend who got a "no" from the loudest mouth here, but without any good objective reasons behind it besides a generic "its not safe".
Now, the following points have been made:
- Danger to the archer/basher because of arrows breaking while quivered
- Danger to the archer because of holding loose arrows in his fingers
- Danger to the archer/basher because of a broken bow
- Archer will possibly suffer an undue or exorbitant financial loss
Firstly, there is near zero danger to the basher because he has a shield in front of him and because a proper shield bash results in
only the target being moved or hitting the ground. If the basher happens to go down, that shield in front of him is stopping most all of injuries.
Secondly, the cost of broken arrows or even more remotely, bows, while unfortunate, is strictly a known and accepted risk of playing the game. It sucks when it happens, and its never done intentionally, but it can happen. My opinion is that if someone doesn't want to have that happen, then they don't have to arch. (This is not an attempt to be punitive to archers.)
Thirdly, it is also my opinion that if someone wants to hold a bunch of arrows in their fingers instead of a quiver and they happen to break their fingers by going down, completely unintentionally of course, then that's their choice and their fault. Use a quiver. It's just like punch blocking reds and not wearing MMA gloves. Is it the red wielder's fault your hand is shattered? Not in the least. So should it be with someone who bashes an archer.
Lastly, I can see and will admit that there is a danger for injury, potentially serious, to an archer landing on his own arrows and breaking them. I think that the odds of this happening are remote, but they do exist. For me, the question is "How real is this danger, when compared to the other dangers we face on the field?" Honestly, I think its remote - no more than broken bones, concussions, or other injuries that happen regularly from accidents in our game. Is this type of injury
more dangerous than what we normally see? That depends on where and to what extent the puncture occurs.
-- As far as grappling the archer goes, sure, there's the same danger of being stabbed to both parties by landing on and breaking arrows, but a grapple is, by BoW definition, a
100% at all times controlled handling/take down of the opponent. There's actually less likely to be such an injury from grappling as there is from a shield bash where the archer is sent flying.
As I said before, archers are not likely to be shield bashed since it has to come from the front or side. The instant their head is turned away its a no-go. They'll see this coming and can run away, stand and fight, or simply surrender as so many of them do already. Again, my opinion, but if you don't want to get knocked on your *, use gear that's not going to injure you or don't play the game. I'm also for allowing metal cops, full metal helms, head shots, and unarmed strikes. Personally, I'm fine with all these risks because I don't think they are any more likely to occur than the risks we face already. Sure, it will be another one to consider, but I'm an adrenaline junkie and thrive on dangerous ****. I want to play harder and come near to as real combat as possible. You've never lived until you've had someone trying to kill you. It's the rush of a lifetime and is only surpassed when you're the victorious one.
Now, all that said, I realize that all that stuff would make Bel a totally different game, but I'm still all for it if the rules begin to change that way. So, if the players' consensus is that its not acceptable, then its not acceptable and I'm cool with that. I might wish it differently, but that's the way this game is being played and I do enjoy this game. I do agree though, that if the consensus is there that bashing archers should be illegal, there should be a rule about it in the BoW.
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tl;dr
I think its an acceptable risk; but if the community does not, that's the way the rules should be. Making a rule to specify it is a good thing.